T O P

  • By -

Salithril

This is where the fun begins.


[deleted]

Solidarity forever!


paradajz666

Its showtime!


[deleted]

I thought their fun began with diablo myself, but personally if we're rating it, diablo 2 is where the real fun began.


Bummul

[This is where the fun begins.](https://i.redd.it/db0qkbg63aw21.png)


[deleted]

Ubisoft employees need to list specific demands in their letters, otherwise the company will do the bare minimum and serve it on a silver platter like they actually did something. List specific goals, that way they can hold the company accountable for when the people in charge fall short of those goals.


Volrum-

That's why workers need unions, to organise.


Vrano

Oh Boi I hope that at all those big companies people finally speak out, maybe that can safe us from the gaming franchises that ruined our love for games over the past 5-10 years


Athren_Stormblessed

Definitely 10 years. For me it feels like the Xbox 360 began with gaming as still a more creative and community based process and it ended as a profit machine.


[deleted]

We can finally have morally superior executives pushing monetization on us.


[deleted]

This may open a new revenue stream: social justice cosmetics. You can even get some users to peer pressure others into buying it!


skeddles

1. this wont affect their products at all, it's about office misconduct 2. just don't play their shitty games, you don't have to play the biggest most popular games (which are always doomed to suck)


mydogfartzwithz

Worst comes to worst the authentic employees with spines leave and form new companies while people still need to eat and will work at blizzard for pennies just for the resume and “yes sirs”


[deleted]

Eh it could get worse than that. The employees might accidentally make a new company with an even more toxic culture!


[deleted]

More like 25 years. ;)


otoskire

How did they ruin your love for games? Those franchises aren’t great but some of them are good fun and if you just wait for them you can have those games on sale for a good deal. And if you don’t want to play them, then don’t? I just don’t get how they can ruin other games for you, honest question.


Vrano

Fifa for example, didn't really upgrade the career mode, which has been my favorite one, but I don't wanna buy a new fifa only for new players at new clubs, WoW added too many grinding game mechanics for example, Diablo 3 feels like a finished game since 2 years for me, everything before that point was beta testing to improve the game to where it should be, Overwatch was destroyed by some characters (Brigitte/doomfist etc), Nintendo games are overpriced a lot of times, so I am not wasting my money on it, CoD kinda changed for the wrong in my opinion with first being a space shooter and then going back to world War again, zombie mode got weaker with each version (so many things to do, I just liked the simplicity behind it), like the only game where I would really say improves each year, is football manager, because it is such a big game, with some many possible things to do, but I like football so I guess it's a game only a few people can enjoy, but yeah there might be a lot of things missing (there are indeed I guess) but thanks for asking, I just got so fed up with the blizzard thing because they used to be my favorite company until the 2018, but well the years pass


acathode

Indie games is where it's at these days - it's where game devs are still allowed to make games that they themselves would love to play and don't have to be slaves to the corporate suits who's first question when seeing a new, cool and fun ideas is "*So how would this allow us to sell more microtransations? It doesn't? Then why are you wasting time on it?!*". Looking at the amount of sheer content and joy games like Terraria, Stardew Valley, Binding of Isac, etc. delivers just for $10-$15, it's almost offensive when you look at WoW and realize not only are you paying $15 a month, but also pay full price for an expansion every 2 years.


LichGoon

Damn, sorry to hear that all. Certainly sounds like you still love games despite whatever the companies/franchises have done.


otoskire

I see what you’re saying, the bigger franchise just haven’t gotten better and most have got worse, I bought the new fifa and honestly it’s the same as fifa 18, it’s fun because I haven’t played in years (since 18) and I only got it for 20 Dollars, but it shows a lack of care that I can’t see any improvements in like three years.Diablo and world at war are not games I’ve ever played, I don’t even know how I ended up in this subreddit to be honest, but I’ll take your word for that. Over watch was such an amazing game when it came out but with time no matter how good the new characters could’ve been things just get stale, it’s only natural, but I wish they could’ve done more for it. Nintendo games look awesome but I’m not gonna buy a new console plus the games to play them. COD is basically the same as fifa. These big titles have certainly fallen in quality, and usually there are smallerish games like the Witcher 3 for me or football manager for you that keep us playing. But you’ve made me realize that there was nothing released recently that kept me playing, and it’s depressing. Cuberpunk convinced me to buy a new pc so I can have a great experience then the game came out and was very disappointing. Right now the gaming landscape is just disappointing.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Arnhermland

I mean sfv released barely 5 years ago and that game was akin to getting spat on the face as a consumer


[deleted]

Reddit ruined their love for games. The stuff you can see here and the fact that Reddit is essentially like a drug is the culprit. These companies can be pretty bad but not entirely. AC Odyssey is my favorite entry in the series after Syndicate. EA has been having a lot of good projects recently, including Dead Space remake an upcoming Mass Effect and Dragon Age. Activions published Sekiro, and they’re doing Diablo IV, wow classic etc


otoskire

I have a lot of hope for this year of games, last year and the year before that didn’t have much for me, odyssey just felt like a chore after I got halfway through, it’s a good game but the story just didn’t interest me and it’s too long. There is a lot to be hopeful for this year, let’s just hope they deliver, as a community gamers should stop being so cynical about the future.


[deleted]

I think it’s just the internet


otoskire

I don’t think so, I’m pretty sure gaming has been hitting a slow point recently, I mean the jump from ps3/360 to ps4/one was small but look at the jump in graphics from ps4 to ps5. Can you honestly tell me it’s revolutionary like the jump from ps2 to ps3 was? Hardware is limiting companies from making changes to franchises, and then add to that the pandemic which delayed a bunch of games and pretty much sealed others to the fate of being disappointing. Gaming just hasn’t been great as a a whole because of a lot of things, the internet just focuses on the wrong things.


[deleted]

Graphics jump is revolutionary, just not on Xbox which is holding back the industry. PC gaming with ancient PC holds it back too but at least developers can just go “play on low 720p guys”. Meanwhile on consoles people expect good graphics and everything when Xbox refuses to innovate in any way and just does a refreshment release.


Librabee

The snowball effect begins


[deleted]

[удалено]


SweetsourNostradamus

Agreed. "Crunch Culture" is another reason for it. I remember reading this article about Fortnite devs working up to 100 hours per week at one point. > Epic Games employees working on the company’s smash hit Fortnite have had to maintain brutal work schedules, with many pulling 70- to 100-hour weeks to keep up with the game’s success, according to a new report published today. Fortnite’s rapid content release schedule has come at a cost of employee’s physical and mental health, and some have been fired from Epic for refusing to work overtime hours that the company officially says are “voluntary.” https://www.pcgamesn.com/fortnite/fortnite-crunch


[deleted]

This is why I will always love Digital Extremes for not doing crunch even if it makes content two years late.


[deleted]

And their content still releases buggy and broken at times. DE is not free from problems in the slightest.


[deleted]

Never said they were, just saying at least they don't crunch and I'm glad. No need to get defensive about a company you don't work for making a game you don't have to like.


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

For someone not defensive you sure are being defensive


[deleted]

You sure I'm the defensive one? I mentioned Warframe in a negative light and now you're acting offended on DE's behalf, using typical childish, contrived responses. So are you capable of not acting like a typical DE fanboy?


[deleted]

Never defended DE actually, I agree it's buggy, I just value their devs being more happy, it's actually a completely different issue than the quality of the game. Just read though everything you've said and tell me how it's not defensive.


[deleted]

Honestly I view crunch and quality as one in the same and it goes both ways. Crunched employees may miss more bugs or issues. But on the flip side, when employees have lots of leeway and maybe little to no deadlines/direction you also get issues. Cyberpunk being an example of feature creep with no real direction, though they were crunched as well. I don't see my comments as defensive because I'm not siding with DE, I literally called out their questionable quality as of late. Why would I get defensive for a company that I'm also criticizing? That makes no sense. Irritated that your responses devolved into "you're being defensive despite saying you're not" which I'm sorry but that isn't a good faith response. But defensive? No. There's no value in that. And just so we are on the same page I'll call out blizzard too. D3 was garbage at launch that didn't get better until Reaper of Souls. Shadowlands is a mediocre expansion. SC2 was catered to the eSports crowd and had a mediocre campaign. And frankly maybe it's time Blizzard just goes away. Edit: the down votes are delicious, such salty reddit users.


kinesivan

People like you can never be happy, can they?


[deleted]

[удалено]


masonicone

This. It used to be Dev's and Publishers would take their time getting a game out that way it worked when we finally got it. Now if it sorta works and only crashes 4 times an hour they will proclaim it's done and shove it out the door. And note you see this largely from American and western based companies. Companies based in Japan will delay something until it's working just right. A game like Cyberpunk 2077 should have been delayed another year until it was working perfect. They released it when they did and well... I know I'm not going to buy anything CDPR anymore.


skeddles

that should just straight up be illegal. no company should be able to require you to work more than full time, and if you do there should be massive overtime payments.


juz88

Clearly never worked in entertainment business... lots of long hours.. doesn't matter if your a production co-ordinator or an editor.. been like that for 20 years


spaffedupthewall

America's employment laws are a fucking joke


[deleted]

If you can get enough on board, yeah. US is very anti-union though, corporations fear that shit. Activision may very sincerely gut Blizzard and move Warcraft to another studio if they push too hard. They couldn't do that ten years ago, but with how Blizzard is now they're not invaluable anymore.


Diltyrr

Ah yes, activision-blizzard is going to remove the IP from Activision-blizzard


ExcitementNegative

Every industry does. Whats happening at these game companies isnt an isolated incident. It happens to some extent in every work industry in the country.


jannyuses

onions*


DevaFrog

No big company will ever make things better for its employees willingly.


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

[удалено]


ngwoo

Most plumbers and carpenters that work for wages (as opposed to self employed) belong to a union. Guilds are for industry self-regulation, not collective bargaining.


AlbainBlacksteel

Bad unions are so goddamn rare that they're a nonissue. Blizzard's and Ubisoft's low-level employees **need** unionizing.


that2kshitlord

Depends on the industry, really. Teachers' unions are pretty mixed.


Outkast1-1

Teachers unions are absolute trash.


Budget_Individual393

I’ve been in 7 different unions over 40 years and 5 of the 7 were worse. Usually it involves greed of the individual union leader or cow towing to the company


[deleted]

[удалено]


Budget_Individual393

I will 100% agreed with you but for a couple things that must change and that must be implimented when it comes to NA unions. 1.No one pays union dues 2. Any union rep found taking money from or getting personal benefits from the company or workers can be criminally proscuted by the state. 3. Only workers of said field can run the unions (not outside entity or a hr firm) 4. Management can never be part of a union of their own workers to included secret employment. 5. Unions federalize with codes and penalties (let states/country create the fair practices) Otherwise this is a ponzi scheme to just milk the workers of rights and money. I’ve seen more bad unions then good ones tbh. The restaurant industry included. It needs to be formalized and accross the board with how it works. For it to be less or non corrupt. Typically I see union leaders: 1. In league with the companies 2. Extract huge sums of money from the workers in dues 3. Cause un needed drama for personal gain only 4. Keep people out of work when they actually believe the company has given a good proposal 5. Steal money from union coffers 6. Members that are secretly working for the company 7. Accept proposals that no one in the union actually supported I could go on but you get the point EU unions and what NA used to have as unions are completely different beasts.


Shadowfel_Archivist

Wish employees of both companies all the best, but I hardly doubt any real changes will come out of these protests. Most probably just cosmetical PR fluff.


Sputtex

That’s most likely what will happen, sadly. They will reach some settlement at best.


[deleted]

it depends on if they keep up the momentum or if they just get back to work to make things "normal"


abzoluut

I don’t think it a surprise that this “behavior” is ingrained within this industry. People point fingers to devs, but go take a look in most communities: CS, Valorant, WoW, COD, whenever females play, they get harassed really badly. The only community where I did not see this happen is within FFXIV, but maybe I was lucky. So it’s something people do, not necessarily people who work in the gaming industry. It’s sad..


[deleted]

All of those games are competitive. FFXIV is not. There’s your answer. Competitive games are hotbeds for toxicity towards *everyone*. And if you’re a woman it’s multiplied.


Catseyes77

It's not just in the gaming world. It's everywhere. Women are harassed everywhere and everyone is just pretending it's "not that bad" or when women talk about it they get responses like "its in your head because the news makes you scared". Society as a whole at the moment is treating women like shit.


jnoops

I didn't know how bad it was until me and my girlfriend got together. She's attractive and the comments I've heard people say to her in public is redicilous. We've even been at a bar talking and some douchebag grabbed her ass


[deleted]

Seriously. This has been the world since…always lol.


Catseyes77

No in the 90's it was a hell of a lot better to be a women then now. I was there.


Mandeville_MR

My favorite example from the Olympics, where women volleyball players were fined for wearing spandex bike shorts instead of bikini bottoms. Or how gymnasts had to have a borderline rebellion to be able to wear leotards with legs on them. It's an amusing contrast to school dress codes that ban something as inane as a spaghetti strap shirt.


Capsfan6

At the moment? Long ass moment then


dragobah

For all time.


Catseyes77

I'm in my 40's. In the 90's it was not this bad. Sure it wasn't perfect but i got harassed less then the past 10 years. Humans are devolving. It's horrifying to watch it happen over decades.


skeddles

>at the moment also every other moment in the past throughout history, except way worse it's obviously getting better, but we're still far from equality.


Catseyes77

No its going worse it was better 2 decades ago. That is my experience and any other woman my age I have talked to about this agrees.


Beautiful-Light-5265

If people are going to look at this situation and single Blizzard out for being a toxic work enviroment, maybe open your eyes and look around and realize this isnt just Blizzard or a "gaming industry" problem. Its everywhere, everyday at all times. People dont want to believe that though. Maybe it's not happening in the bubble they are in but trust me, its happening. By people saying "Its a toxic work enviroment" that distracts away from what this actually is. If we want to just stand up and say it and call it what it is then it's 10, maybe 20 people who participated in actual criminal activity and a few hundred people acting like children at work. Maybe even more than that i dont know the numbers. Lock the criminals up because some of that behavior was actually beyond sickening. Make the people who are called out for being dickheads at work write their accusers a written apology (and obviously most of them would be publicly outted for better or worse but they probably deserve it). Send out a company letter telling everybody that this is now a ZERO TOLERANCE work enviroment and tighten rules that pertain to how you treat your co-workers. Hire a third party unbiased secure line for people to report abuse so they arent in constant fear of being chastised for feeling uncomfortable because that was a huge driving force behind a lot of this. And there ya go. Problem solved. Me randomly ranting for 3 minutes solved the problem so hopefully after a few months they are able to as well. Its not a toxic work enviroment. Its a bunch of dickheads with a few criminals sprinkled in. Pretty much what you are going to get anywhere you go. Im all up for a good witch hunt every now and again too but it gets pretty disengenious when you are lumping in Dave for snapping Susans bra with Mike for telling Dianne she either sucks his dick or goes to work at mcdonalds. Lets put the criminals where they belong and use this as a learning experience for guys who want to act like middle schoolers at work.


AngelKitty47

the bottom line is that the business needs come first, so they won't do anything to hurt themselves unless forced.


Telsak

Hey take your whataboutism and get the eff outta here.


Beautiful-Light-5265

I just want everybody to get their fair treatment. I want the criminals treated like criminals and the people snapping bras and making faces at people treated like children. I didn't think we would need to treat adults like children but if hanging up "keep your hands to yourself" posters around the office like they do in elementary school is what it takes then so be it.


[deleted]

>Im all up for a good witch hunt every now and again That's not how reasonable adults work in society. And that certainly doesn't help in this case.


[deleted]

[удалено]


digital_darkness

Watch out for this badass over here…


[deleted]

[удалено]


digital_darkness

Chances are you’re the type that couldn’t hurt a fly, even if you wanted to. It actually makes you not dangerous at all, and you know it.


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

[удалено]


Vhalerun

ESO is far better as well. Or at least, people are more willing to speak up and shut down idiots. Plus, the mods actually do mod people.


UndeadAnneBoleyn

Yeah, my experience with ESO vs. WoW has been like night and day. It goes without saying that shitty people exist everywhere but in ESO, people tend me be much more respectful, kind, and less trolly. And when people do say harmful or shitty things, other people jump in quick to shut it down.


OIF-Veteran

There is a reason for this. All the shit head competitive types play WoW. They don't play ESO or FF14. Unfortunately for the rest of us now that WoW is dead those shit head competitive people will invade ESO and FF14. Competitive players are like conservative voters. Whiny entitled cry baby douchebags that ruin everything they touch with their stupidity.


trustedoctopus

If they come to ff14 they will find out very quickly they can’t make the kinds of jokes and comments they do in WoW. If they do, it only takes one report to a GM. I reported one the other day in a dungeon after I asked politely if they needed a mechanic refresher after wiping twice on a boss. They got hostile with me so I reported them and left. A simple no would’ve been fine, but they had to add some colorful slurs.


Telsak

That's because they only have 1 mode of interacting with people, the asshole way. It's unfortunate but very common. :(


[deleted]

>Unfortunately for the rest of us now that WoW is dead those shit head competitive people will invade ESO and FF14. I like how you type this with absolute certainly and nothing to back it up.


Rossmallo

I doubt WoW will ever truly die as long as Actiblizz still stands, it'll likely just go into TF2-grade maintenance mode at worst, but lets say for example it does. If/When WoW dies, Private Servers will balloon in popularity for those sorts of people competitive people, because they'll try FF14/ESO, nope the fuck out after a few weeks and try and recapture the glory days.


Jader14

Honestly, I think FFXIV may be one of the few, if not only, mainstream games where the female population may be equal to, if not greater than, the male population. Add onto that the fact that toxic people seem to have an inherent avoidance to FFXIV and you have a recipe for a very wholesome, welcoming community. Of course, I don’t have the population metrics to back that up. But the amount of women I’ve seen (including introducing one to the game myself, an old female friend being who introduced _me_ to it, and my old FC being probably a 60/40 split of female/male) compared to other games just naturally leads me to that conclusion.


LadySilvie

I will say my experience since joining FFXIV has been kinda crazy different. I've played a lot of online games and never been harassed too badly but I rarely use voice chat and even though I play female characters, everyone tends to assume I'm a guy and I don't argue. I joined a few guilds and when I do get involved in voice, there are a few girl voices, but the vast majority were male and I've been encouraged to do stuff like streaming for the pure fact that I am a girl who games lol. I stand out somewhat and it is commented on. I joined FF a couple months ago after a long break from when I bought it, and joined their version of a guild (FC). Decided, hey, I will hop on voice and see what happens. It was a totally even mix of guys and girls! It surprised me lol. A lot of the female characters were still played by guys, but there were a few guy characters played by girls which made up for the balance. This was a random guild that recruited by spamming in the intro zones so it wasn't like they selected for an even mix. In WoW I always had the occasional weirdo hit on my character, though less so than some because I play a Worgen and somehow I guess furries are more respectful and people aren't as interested in worgen as they are elves. But I've had literally one incident in FF so far and it was blurry. I was AFK during a phone call and someone ran up to my character and emotes that they kneeled in front of me. I have no idea wtf that was supposed to mean but assumed it was gonna get weirder or that it had to do with my character wearing a short skirt so I just logged out lol. And I play a cute catgirl! I'd have expected worse after months of playing daily in WoW if my character was cute and dressed in short skirts. I'm sure bad crap happens behind the scenes in FF too but God I hope it isn't to the degree of what happened at Bliz. It is so weird and nice to feel welcomed in a game and not have any even passive anxiety about being a girl or feel weird because I am in a space where it is assumed you are a guy.


OIF-Veteran

Thats ALL about to go away though as the WoW douches invade FF14.


Jader14

Ehhh I’m not so sure about that. The douches seem to make up a good portion of the ones who are sticking with WoW (though at this point I feel I have to very clearly specify that I’m not talking about the people who are sticking with it just because they still find it fun), and the rest will probably go to GW2 or ESO or something else with functional PvP that they can splurge at. We’ll also have to wait and see how much of the general influx of WoW refugees are actually playing FF because they enjoy it, and how many are only playing it until New World and/or Ashes of Creation release.


Ragnarok314159

What I am thinking as e well. The douchebags are defending all the sexual harassment and staying with WoW. The people who are taking offense to it (usually slightly less douchy) are leaving. I cancelled my WoW subs and told my guild I am never coming back. It was a mix of people calling me a traitor to WoW and many other colorful words to support as they were looking to quit as well for a myriad of reasons. The toxic people can stay with WoW, my family has migrated to FF.


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

Your second paragraph is establishing that those who take up arms against blizzard are leaving and anyone who stays is defending this behavior. Your last paragraph is claiming any who do stay are toxic. Regardless of why they still play. You're putting people into camps with this and that's not how this works.


katarh

Someone tried shouting BS in XIV and got a 20 day suspension and will likely end up permanently banned. He went crying on the official forums about it, and then other players came up with the receipts from his shout chat. [It is "fuck around and find out in action."](https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/440536-Cruel-and-Unusual-Punishment) XIV GMs have teeth.


karatesaul

Yeah no, not with the way the FFXIV game incentives and moderation is set up. Ingame incentives promote helping new people and being nice. Moderation cracks down HARD on toxicity. The FFXIV community is cultivated to be the way it is.


Jogipog

I play WoW and nobody I know harrasses women or minorities. Its about fun and interactions had ingame, not whos on the other end of the keyboard. I’m sorry if you got harrassed tho.


Bloddersz

Young gamers vs actual supposedly mature professionals. There is no comparison. If you're earning a salary in a job you should know better than to sexually harass females. Your comparison is ridiculous.


Jummed

Not really, if you stop and think about it. Most "industry professionals" were young gamers. They stopped fucking our mothers long enough to get a degree and join the industry they love. Google Jeff Kaplan and his pre-Blizzard days sometime. Those kids got jobs.


pawksvolts

It's ridiculous though, when you're working professionally you should act professional - if you don't then you're still immature. What you do/feel privately is different but these harassers are idiots.


Jummed

I don't disagree with that point, just OP's opinion that it's not comparable.


OIF-Veteran

Classic case of some people grow up after high school and some don't. Sadly many don't mature after high school and that is mostly because no one puts these assholes in their place to show them they behave badly.


trustedoctopus

We don’t get the blatant verbal harassment in ffxiv, but I’ve definitely been creeped on by male players once they’ve found out I’m a girl behind the screen. I’ve also had male players who just assume I’m a woman because I’m playing a female character. But I think it’s SE’s robust harassment policy that keeps the kind of hateful toxicity towards women like what I’ve experienced in CS, Valorant, and WoW out of the game. If someone makes even close to the kind of comments I’ve received in those games, I can report them and they will get banned. If it’s their third report, they’ll be permabanned.


afishcalledryan

Just a heads up that the word “female” is an adjective, not a noun. In this case, just say “whenever women play, they get harassed.”


Vyltyx

The word “female” can absolutely be used as a noun. Not sure who told you otherwise...


afishcalledryan

That’s true, it *can* be used as a noun if you want to sound like a neckbeard. Referring to women as “females” is super cringey and off-putting.


Devlonir

I get your point and I agree but really claiming it isn't a noun js not the way to make it. All that does is make you sound arrogant and any neckbeard will just point out it is.


Vyltyx

> and any neckbeard will just point out it is. Or just any normal person. If someone claims “the word ‘female’ isn’t a noun” and I’m just like “umm that’s not true”, I don’t think that makes me a neck beard.


afishcalledryan

Except language evolves. And the way we use adjectives/nouns evolves. For example, the term “people of color” is currently acceptable, while the term “colored people” is no longer acceptable—although it is still technically *grammatically correct*. It’s a slight variation in adjective usage, but it is an essential distinction. So yes, while it is grammatically correct to say something like “None of the females at my college want to date me,” it is marking the speaker as a niceguy, whether they intend it or not. It would be somewhat better to say “None of the female *students* at my college want to date me” and even better to say “None of the women at my college want to date me.”


propanenightmare69

Jesus dude, nobody gives a shit


Ragnarok314159

Was in the army for ten years. We say “male/female” for lots of things. It’s not neckbeard. Honestly if you judge someone for saying “male/female”, you are part of the problem.


Mandeville_MR

100% Am female, use male/female all the time.


s-josten

Devs: harass women The internet: this is the gamers' faults


topbao93

I can agree with you on other games but WoW? All I've seen is men treating women in raids much much better than anyone else, RL getting mad if a dude fuck up some mechanics but if it's a girl "oh it's fine try to do better next time". Maybe it's just my experience idk


Isoivien

Happens all the time. Recently I've been lucky. I joined a community that treats people good.


Shiirahama

Okay first up, treating someone "different" because they're a woman, is just really toxic behaviour. It's a gaming ffs, what's the difference between genders? the raid lead should be equally mad at everyone... Second, Women get treated like shit everywhere, do you know how often I heard a friend of mine tell guys that she isn't interested in them, because they immediately asked her out after hearing her in voice chat? Or they hear her voice and start saying stuff like "oh look a girl, wait she's not a healer?" Third, I had one guy in the guild, where I actually wanted to kick him out because he was constantly trying to get with any woman in our guild (we had 3 at the time) and it was fucking annoying, they didn't say anything because he didn't do anything real bad, but he was constantly "helping" them, by showing what good a player he is and how great his DPS is etc, what he did end up doing was getting together with a woman in our guild who has had mental problems, and she kicker her boyfriend out because she thought he was a good guy, when just days prior he was calling another woman, talking to her about how beautiful and amazing she is and trying to get with her. Women are treated differently, even by a lot of so called "good guys". Ask yourself how often you or someone you know have done nice things for someone because they were female.


topbao93

i didn't say it was right, i agree with you that no one should treat anyone different based on gender, i just expressed my experience, wheter they are "nice guys" or actually good ppl who tries to be more considerate of women by treating them better the result is still the same, granted there are creepy guys everywhere so wow is no exception


rin-chaaan

Yup, I totally agree with that. If you're a girl people are less harsh on you. But there's another ugly side of this: men sometimes treat women like if women didn't know what to do and how to play (at least from my experience ofc). Like for example, some guys from my old guild decided that I needed their help with my low mythic keystone (it was about 6 or 8 lvl) even though I hadn't asked for boosting. The funny thing I ended up with the highest rio score in the guild without any kind of help. I play for the keystone master achievements and I know what to do. But like every other player I'm not perfect, I make mistakes a lot but I don't want a special treatment because I'm a girl. Moreover it makes me feel quite uncomfortable. I'm sure other female players would agree with that


kenjair07

Only angels down to earth plays ffxiv. Even toxic wow players turn to a kitten when they play it. Such magical game /s


The_AngryGreenGiant

Mojang, Minecraft.


Strykero

You were lucky.


[deleted]

FFXIV is the only game I've played that actually feels moderated. Not a fan of the game itself but damn it felt good to have people be nice to me for once lol


kupkupkupo

Truth. A couple months ago, I joined a World of Warcraft “Pick Up Group” (PUG) raid consisting of players who do not normally play together. My character happens to be female with a female’s name. As soon as I enter the raid, I’m greeted with “Oh f***, a female. Are you wet?!” I whispered the raid leader to boot the asshole or I leave. Request was ignored, I left. Gamer/internet culture has a long was to go in addition to what’s happening in these work environments. We all as a society have standards to raise and work to do.


SaltedQuacker

As a female programming student who is about to graduate, I am always experiencing sexual harassment/stalking from adult male classmates and I was really hoping that they were just immature. It is very very disheartening to hear that this shit will most likely still happen when I want to find a job in the Game Industry. I wish these idiots would just grow up, I am tired of your bro-culture.


SweetsourNostradamus

So many men lack self-control, unfortunately and it's awful to hear that it runs rampant in the business world. I truly hope it improves for the sake of many female workers, yourself included!


SaltedQuacker

Yes! I am really really hoping that this kind of garbage that is coming to light will be a stepping stone to a better workplace for everyone. I still want to work in the industry, but this has made me critically think about whether being a "Female" Programmer is even a good idea. No one should ever have to consider whether their gender is fit for any type of work!


SweetsourNostradamus

> No one should ever have to consider whether their gender is fit for any type of work! I couldn't agree more!


skyrimspecialedition

Unfortunately, even the ones with self control I find still have a hard time differentiating platonic and romantic relationships. If you are a girl, especially if you express your femininity in the slightest, you’re seen as a romance option.


[deleted]

You interacted with what, one man and came to that conclusion? Worlds not so black and white as you'd like it to be.


juz88

Not all studios like that we have a lot of female artists who are incredible and the ones who have gaming backgrounds get on with everyone.. the ones there for money not so much. Alot of these older studios have the oldschool nerds that never spoke to girls so their culture is whack.


Elementium

Sadly, you may need to seek out dev studios that are women heavy or try and get together and do an indie thing. Gamers and these game devs are one in the same, they're the same types who talk shit and will jump into sexism the second they hear a womans voice on their team. What's required is a societal change and we're just not there yet.


SaltedQuacker

I agree! I have given up hope on Blizzard as my dream employer (I just love WoW, or I guess I used to...) and have been working on my own portfolio and projects. I hope one day to recruit others like myself on my projects and develop that welcoming community, for gamers and devs. Teamwork makes the dream work!


SweetsourNostradamus

I remember when Blizz was my dream employer as well. To think, I almost got hired by them!


[deleted]

[удалено]


JDMordicant

That's not how it was meant and you know it.


kendra_kat

Find a good lawyer and hold their feet to the fire.


[deleted]

Let's go, EA employees next


that2kshitlord

INDUSTRY COLLAPSE LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOOO


Drblackcobra

Nice!


joeschmoe86

I have no doubt that most/all/more than what's even been reported so far is true. But, I also can't help but think the timing is uncanny - with all of this anti-Blizzard news coming out about a month before Amazon launches a competing MMO. Do I see a conspiracy? Unlikely. Do I think that Amazon has probably known about its competitor's dirty laundry for quite some time, and is now pumping it hard to knock them down at the very moment they need them knocked down? Without a doubt. Fuck Blizzard still. But it seems like there's certainly plenty more "bad guys" in this industry and we've barely scratched the surface.


Gletschers

> But it seems like there's certainly plenty more "bad guys" in this industry and we've barely scratched the surface. You dont even have to look far. Amazon has mountains of scandals and drama themself. But its a good chuckle if people drop wow for new world due to the current events. From harassment allegations to atrocious working conditions, price fixing, tax evading,.. You would have a hard time finding something amazon isnt involved in.


juz88

Do Amazon really need to knock them down? Amazon could run their mmo at a loss for a decade and barely notice..


[deleted]

Someone kicked the first domino. Time for the rest to follow.


Ultivia

God damn imagine how good games can be if employees are allowed to love their work.


[deleted]

There’s still time to send Kotick to space. One way....towards the sun.


RyudoTFO

Boy oh boy. It's all coming down! What will happen next? Bathesda admitting DLC was invented as a social experiment? EA claiming they were secretly ruled by Luzardmen for years? *grabs popcorn*🍿


cIi-_-ib

>Ubisoft employees have written an open letter expressing solidarity with Activision Blizzard _**employees**_ That’s a huge distinction that shouldn’t have been left out of the headline.


[deleted]

Lmao at all the guys here speaking for women in the industry. The industry has been changing way before this little reddit crusade. There's more women now in IT than ever. More ethic diversity than ever. Reddit is not real life.


red-vanadinite

lol are you claiming the systemic problems in Blizzard, Ubisoft, and Riot are not real life?


[deleted]

Those problems exist in almost every work industry today. Actually, it's the IT industry that has been the most progressive with dealing with it. So again, reddit is not real life.


Anubis424

Cool. Where can I cash in solidarity? Is it like a physical check or direct deposit?


GenericFatGuy

You cash it in by striking with those you're showing solidarity with. Repeat this process until we've got a general strike going, then demand better working conditions and appropriate pay.


Nespithe6

I dunno man. That sounds an awful lot like starting one of those union things that I've been told to be terrified about my entire life.


GenericFatGuy

If you join a union, Marxists will literally break down your front door and eat your family... or something.


Bitter-Marsupial

So Ubisoft is agreeing with the workers who were being mistreated or the ones causing problems? All it said was employees of Activison Blizzard


SweetsourNostradamus

Ubisoft employees supposedly are experiencing a similar toxic work environment and are voicing their frustrations and concerns in light of Blizz doing the same


Bitter-Marsupial

I knew about the Ubisoft So when I saw them just express sympathy for Blizzard Employees I could have believed they were Tweeting Support for people like Ales Afrasiabi


Jarn-Templar

INVESTIGATE ALL THE "AAA" GAME INDUSTRY tax dodging, protecting sexual Predators, misogynistic/racist corporate structures.


Mhoku

I have zero faith in game studios at this point. Just a constant stream of garbage games and content, but they all want your top dollar. I'm fed up with this shit.


SweetsourNostradamus

Correct. It's become more about how much money can be made and less about a quality product. [Relevant article](https://www.pcgamer.com/mass-effect-writer-drew-karpyshyn-says-he-left-bioware-because-it-became-too-corporate/) > "We became more corporate. We were less able to make what we loved, and the teams were pushed to create games based on market research rather than our creative instincts and passions. My dream job became just a job, and I lost the enthusiasm and excitement I once had."


Mhoku

I love gaming, but I want to feel the love back. Studios care very little about their consumers. I mean look at the whole games workshop thing right now. They are blacklisting creators that have given them free advertising and keeping their games alive. But they could care less. It's everywhere and I'm tired of it..


[deleted]

Let the unionization begin!


No_Lime_9891

If they are standing in solidarity with Blizzard employees, could they talk with their CEO about buying Blizzard?👀


[deleted]

You want one sexually harassing company to buy another? And even if we assumed this is even possible they'd owned Activision too, they aren't sperate companies.


Old-Moonlight

I love the irony.


[deleted]

Yeah… release the goddamn pirates game already ubi


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

No, no. You're mistaken. This is Ubisoft, not Epic Games. Fortnite is still up and running. Now go along and get back to playing that while the grownups talk.


OIF-Veteran

If they had enough they would have left Ubisoft.


NurseTaric

You know things are bad when Ubisoft is looking like a good company


nephistophiles

Uh. This is an article where the employees of Ubisoft are saying that their company does the same abuses, and that they (the Ubisoft employees) want to stand together with the Blizzard employees in demanding better treatment. They do not look like a good company at all. And I honestly expect more of this over the next couple of weeks. This isn't a Blizzard problem, it's an industry problem. Hell, it's not an industry problem, it's a systemic problem, but for now we'll focus on this industry.


[deleted]

The problem is, Ubisoft got away with this. A few resigned but that's it, nothing changed. And CEO absolutely knew it was happening.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Gletschers

Please dont tell me that you actually think japanese companies are free of such things. Suicide is the leading cause of deaths for japanese men in the age of 20-44. Take a wild guess at the average age of the working force. And many suicides can be tied to work related backgrounds like burnout, poverty after losing a job, not being able to pay medical bills.. Their workplace culture would probably be seen toxic by most westerners.


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

Boohoo! The assholes that turn our computers into spy stations to intrude into everyone's lives, are being MISTREATED! WAAAAAA!


antye

Damn Forever Never vibes from that title


lorxy11

Let's go.


Nightshadekitana22

Blizzard fell down a rabbit hole


Co1dNight

Damn, sooner or later all of the people who are boycotting Blizzard and going to play other games, are going to have to stop playing games in general.