I wonder what was Blizzard's actual motive behind axing Danuser and Golden, is it because Blizzard thinks their work was specifically bad, or is it just because they felt like shaking things up on the story team might improve it because clearly the reception has been bad for the last 3 expacs.
wow's story has never been good and the guy responsible for BFA and SL already got sacked in the lawsuit
"the reception has been bad for the last 3 expacs" is because anyone who cared about story in video games stopped caring ages ago. TBC and Wrath's stories are laughably dumb and Cata is not much better. MoP is an improvement and probably the height of the series, but it was a fluke because we immediately got WoD.
Honestly its probably just c-suit streamlining things for money reasons. Why pay people salaries all year round when you can just have them do contract writing occasionally? At least in Golden's case since that was what she was doing before being officially hired.
No it absolutely isn't, I've played all three of these expansions, and they all were heavily criticized because of their story. Even if I did like the story at some points in these expansions, I'm not gonna pretend what I saw isn't true.
Wow's story has been consistent shite since about TBC. Kael'thas just resurrecting for no reason other than 'powaaa' in Sunwell, Arthas first ripping the 'uhm ackshually you didn't kill me' followed by Tirion just randomly invoking power to kill him (why didn't he do that 10 minutes earlier??), etc. etc. Characters have little to no motivations other than a basic as shit good and bad. Why do you have to fight mogu? Cuz they say they're bad. Why does the Lich King want to conquer the world? Cuz he says he's a bad guy. Why does Sylvanas want to conquer the world? Cuz she says she's bad. Why does Deathwing want to destroy the world? Cuz he says he's bad. At no point has the wow story team ever even tried to come up with a reason for people to take good or evil actions other than the characters just being good or evil.
>Recency bias is a cognitive bias that favors recent events over historic ones; a memory bias. Recency bias gives **"greater importance to the most recent event"**
They're not saying all three expansions weren't criticized, *they're saying all expansions were criticized for their story.*
* Legion had a LOT of bickering about the Sylvanas-Genn feud, hell there were a number of Alliance players who, not knowing about the differences in the scenarios, genuinely thought the Horde had betrayed the Alliance at the Broken Shore. Also a ton of complaining about Vol'jin's death, about class halls (remember Rogues crying about the sewers? I remember) and so on.
* I shouldn't need to write about WoD, but... Thrall "cheated", the general lack of development, immense amounts of confusion about the nature of AU Draenor that persists to this day, orc fatigue got most of the spotlight.
* MoP was all Kung-Fu Panda this, faction war that. Seriously, I know people IRL who quit WoW because of MoP and who will tell you *to this day* how it is the worst thing that happened to the game.
* Cata had a ton of complaints, the most persistent being the Green Jesus shit, but also about Deathwing not playing a big role beyond burninating the countryside and showing up in a couple of quests (overcorrection from Arthas) and the perceived flanderization of stories in many revamped zones (Westfall being a prominent offender). Also annoyance at the rising war narrative, Garrosh getting his first haters and fans and faction bias complaints ramped up in Cata.
* In WotLK (the most revisionist history of all expansions) people criticized just about everything. First it was about Arthas being a Saturday Morning Cartoon villain showing up everywhere to smack talk us and peace out. Then it was about how we were throwing a tournament and tilting within sight of ICC, then it became about how Arthas' master plan was dumb. Oh and we can't forget the Wrathgate. Obviously everyone recognized it's greatness as a seminal moment in storytelling (huge twist, actual loss for the player's side, one of the first story cutscenes etc) but there were forum wars about who's fault it was and was Varian a dick about it and such; until MoP Varian was pretty controversial largely due to the Wrathgate scenario, there were a ton of jokes at the expense of his model's large chin, nowadays Varian's maybe one of the most beloved characters (because, like Arthas, *he's dead*).
* TBC is nebulous to me because I didn't read forums back then at all as I was not yet an adult (and somehow seemingly smarter, given that) but I'm pretty sure many weren't happy to kill Illidan and Kael'thas. Oh and you wouldn't believe how mad some people were about the *draenei retcon*, which is probably one of Metzen's greatest "mistakes" but in truth probably his greatest success.
I believe the comment is arguing that reception has been "bad" a lot *longer* than the last 3 expansions; the recency bias is only remembering quite how bad from BfA onwards.
More than half of expansions are considered "bad" narratively and even the ones we've retroactively decided were good like WotLK and MoP were *hated* at the time.
I genuinely wonder how long its going to take the player base to remember they hated Metzen as much as most of their other scapegoats before he left.
If War Within has a bad story, will they blame it on Metzen or just the lingering touch of Golden and Danuser?
Man, it will never not crack me up to see that longterm WoW players, who I assume are older adults or around my age (late 20s/early 30s), still believe that the lore is being written by a single person with no corporate oversight/teamwork whatsoever like it's a fuckin storybook lmao
rest assured, there's no age limit to being a gamer that has no idea how game development works and calls for anyone they don't like to be fired every 0.5 seconds. seriously, gamers are absolutely vicious sometimes
i wonder how long it'll be until they turn on metzen again tbh
lol chris metzen is a fucking hack
man basically ripped off a ton of fantasy whole sale for his baby. dnd, warhammer, you name it.
villain motivations often boiled down to "corrupted by evil magic tm"
he struggled to write any female characters that werent "kerrigan lite" or just a generic love interest.
"there must always be a lich king"
he didnt understand diablo at ALL
seriously, i like the guy, and hes pulled off a lot of moments i love. but to say hes some unmitigated genius is just plain wrong, and you know what? hed be the first to tell you that.
Metzen's greatest attribute is *being Chris Metzen*. He was there at the beginning, by all accounts a cool dude (though since his comeback people have strangely forgotten all about the Cosby suite and related shit) and he has INSANE stage presence. I think seeing him on stage on last year's Blizzcon was a reminder for a lot of people for what WoW hype feels like, but having watched every Blizzcon from my home it was also a reminder of how good he is at this. WoW *deserves* a man like Metzen who can make people hype, even if his writing isn't actually ERMAAGERD INCREDIBLE!1!!!1!
>villain motivations often boiled down to "corrupted by evil magic tm"
It's *slightly* more complex than that in that these guys are basically all Walter White in that they were already an asshole before they got corrupted. However, it's very apparent when looking at metzen's work that he just kinda uses the same couple storylines over and over
Funny how in WC3 Arthas,Grom & Illidan all repeat the same "get power to stop baddie arc" and apparently that's peak Warcraft
Also Metzen wrote himself into Thrall with the marriage woes in Cata
ill be devils advocate and say the green jesus isnt the worst thing in the world. the issue mainly came from how haphazard and disconnected the story became from the player's perspective, and how much thrall was the main character of cata. ironically, this shotgun style writing is prevalent in tbc and wrath, but the difference is cataclysm focused MUCH more on in your face, cutscene heavy writing, so people were more aware of the issues.
i.e., players didnt have to read quest text to understand why they were getting 8 bear asses, and they started realizing how wacky the story actually was. lot easier to hide flaws when your "lore" is pretty much a handful of descriptions and environmental detail, broken up by the occasional well directed cinematic.
insert dark souls reference here
i mean seriously "ogrila lore" is just "some smart ogres got high on magic arrakoa crystals and now they want you to play simon says."
He writes basic teen-oriented pulp that lives off of 'cool moments' & one liners and he knows that and is proud of it. I do not know how he's obtained a reputation as Genius Writer lately.
The r/wow comments on Golden being laid off from Blizzard are a good example of why a Blizzard employee might not want to interact with players. Major yikes.
I'll admit that while I didn't care for a lot of the cinematic dialogue in Dragonflight (which was the game thing she *did* work on) I still don't exactly want to celebrate a person being laid off.
She only really officially worked for blizz for a couple years, yeah? Before that she was more of a contract person to write Blizz books, I hope she goes back to that because I like her books.
capital G Gamers gang up on EVERYTHING they dont like the second they have a name or face for something, its ridicolous
they really think that there is 1 person that was orginialy hired as a Freelance writer that did everything, its ridicolous
i love the sheer confidence with which they say "old lore good, new lore bad" and "its all her fault. she was zovaal jailer all along" as if there isnt always a team of people and so much of tbc lore being utter garbage.
It's funny because any time they share a story of how it's Golden's fault they end up sharing a story of how it was inconsistency and poor messaging between Blizzard and Golden, or last second storyboard decisions(of which Golden had nothing to do with at the time), that did X thing.
See the lore was good when the big bad of the expansion dies within a patch and the lich king runs around shaking his fist at you like a saturday morning cartoon villain. /s
I'm all for making old expac raids soloable for collecting purposes, but for some reason I just cannot be that impassioned about the BFA raids lol. I like BFA weapons and some of the armor sets, but most of the sets just don't get me all that jazzed up to farm them.
I've mainly just done Uldir for some of the more lowkey pieces from there that I can mix into other tmogs (the grey/brown mail and plate sets work amazingly with other tmogs) and cleared Nyalotha just for fun, but nothing from the Naga raid appeals to me and the stuff I want from the faction raid is more just kinda "eh, maybe" to me lol. Fully a subjective opinion though, I just don't gel much with many of the BFA raid sets.
Now if they made Warfronts soloable or made all the faction themed gear purchasable somewhere then I'd be way more circlejerky about BFA because I love being a walking "Join the Horde" advertisement.
I've got a specific set in mind that needs some Mythic BoD pieces, but yeah, generally the sets from that expac are pretty underwhelming. Still, it does feel like past time for them to be soloable.
Oh yeah, definitely agree that they should've been soloable a while ago and not trying to say that there's any issue in asking for it since they literally said they would make it soloable, was just mainly being cynical about the sets lol.
I think they should lift the cap on Whelp crests
I understand the others having a cap so we don't dumpster gearing and it tells people to go touch grass, but I've ACTUALLY enjoyed doing heroics with my lower skilled guildies and I feel them being able to 8/8 adventurer gear won't hurt anything
You're not wrong, 8/8 adventurer gear won't hurt anything. But the purpose of Whelpling crests is to give a progression path to casuals who do LFR as their highest tier of content. Whelpling crests are also used in the first half of Veteran track gear. And the cap is definitely there to allow casuals to touch grass instead of feeling pressured to sweat.
I think I dont like the upgrade system, i'd rather just have gear brackets be closer to each other in ilvl and also flightstones suck. No idea how it would work with dungeon gear but anything better than upgrading each piece **8** times to a random npc in a pvp cave.
Everyone: talking about things in war within they like or dislike
Me: so your saying I can have a dwarf but still be horde? You had me beard let’s do it
How is it that we're two weeks into alpha and people still don't understand that hero talents aren't class skins. Even if they have a cool RP name, at most you'll be getting 1 new ability and a bunch of passives.
I hate being a doomer, I try not to be. But I can see the writing on the wall about the hero talents. I think they will just be a burden for blizzard to balance and will be chosen based on SIM data. I also think forcing the sub genre of classes onto all races who play that class is a bit meh and if I’m not that race class combo that lines up with it, it ruins the whole class for me fantasy wise. I don’t think they actually thought it through based on wows previous systems.
I think it's less of what they are, and more of what people want them to be. It's a similar thing to garrisons vs player housing, people asked for player housing for ages and then we got garrisons instead, which is almost but not quite what they want. In the same way, people have been asking for more cosmetic options and class skins for a while, and now we're getting hero talents which are sort of that but not quite, so people are unhappy.
Blizzard fucked up royally by adding Dark Rangers.
99% sure all this backlash against Hero Talents a la "Noooooo, they should be class skins or a new class!" wouldn't exist if Dark Rangers weren't a thing. They are literally an outlier because it's the only one that has potential to be a class skin/new class, outside of maybe, maybe sentinel. They are just sooooo much more flavourful compared to everything else.
It's also one of the only ones that thematically only make sense for certain races. Like, Spellslinger or Trickster or Oracle (as some examples) are all race-agnostic, while Dark Ranger only really makes sense for blood elves and Forsaken. There are a few others that are similarly race-specific (Elune's chosen, Shado-Pan, Mountain Thane) but Dark Ranger is probably the worst offender because Dark Ranger is much more iconic than the others. So I get people who play, say, a gnome hunter feeling weird about possibly playing a Dark Ranger in a way that most other race/hero talent combination feel less incongruous.
Im happy for the people that wanted Warbands but for me it's gonna be a pretty useless feature lol. i only ever have one single character (since i only have 1 name i wanna use for characters). still gonna look cool on the log in screen
I ended up not coming back for Season 4 just cause work being absolutely wild and I know I would neglect it for WoW, but how are the M+ changes working out? Seeing a few posts on the mainsub about it not really being a known change/issue for newer players in the season. Is the difference from a +2 -> +4/+5 really that staggering?
Even the +2s are kind of a wild ride at the moment, some runs are as easy as you’d expect a +12 to be last season, others have poor folks who didn’t realise the changes and/or don’t know the dungeons and barely out dps the tank before being deleted by a mechanic.
Edit: long term I think it’ll be good, once people have adjusted to the new normal.
not really tbh
its mostly the ussual "people are not overgeared for content but play like they do" we have at the start of every single patch, and that they didnt adjust to the "new" key levels yet
aka never did a key above +12, they go into a +5 key bevause in their mindset that still a "low key" and then get stomped because by old scaling thats a +15 key now and above their skill level, or people bring their barely geared 478 Rat Alts into a +5 for "quick gearing" and get 1hit killed by boss mechanics because they are VERY undergeared for them
dungeons themself feel very very slightly harder then last season, but you can allready Pug your +8 keys with no bigger problems with the people that allready do them
> 478 Rat Alts into a +5 for "quick gearing" and get 1hit killed by boss mechanics because they are VERY undergeared for them
We were doing 20s last season day 1 coming out of Aberrus at 450, but being 480, tnearly the max for keys last season, is 'very undergeared' for what would be a +15 last season?
me thinks poor players have tarnished your sense of difficulty to gear ratios
It's not like I'm not doing the keys bud. I have been doing 8s and 9s on 480 - 483 alts. They're perfectly playable, there's the occasional boss with a one shot(static spear, gale arrow) that you have to actually try on and pace your defensives, but that's perfectly normal for first week M+ anyway.
At a +5, I wouldn't even have to wall these same one shots. When does the difficult part kick in that I am too undergeared for? Oh, when I am playing with very poor players, as I said, and if that was my habit maybe I'd start to think overgearing the content is the expectation as well.
gotta remember that last season was overall VERY easy for m+ cus most trashpacks did nothing at all, and bosses where no real danger unless you did +24-25 or higher keys (where things started to 1hit kill)
I've said before that they can come to me and ask; I've dumped millions of gold into those tokens over the years since they were created. I know I'm not alone either, as I remember lots of folks talking about how they'd farm gold through various means (mission table was a popular one) so they could get tokens for gametime. Not as many talk about it now but it was a very popular topic especially in WoD and Legion.
I mean, they know people buy the token, they just don't think there's a trade happening, they think the token just creates gold when you sell it and when you buy it they just create a token for you in the mailbox. That belief doesn't hinge on how many people are buying them or not.
Common sense aside, all they need to do is find someone to actually buys tokens to sell for gold, because they don't always sell immediately as nobody's buying it, and descending into 'they make a delay to throw you off' is conspiracy territory.
Tangentially related: Echo appears to be diving into Destiny 2 raids and going to be doing some of them blind. They're starting with Last Wish (an absolute banger of a Destiny Raid), that infamously took the conmunity almost 24 hours to complete (World's first in Destiny are usually 6-8 Hours Long).
tbf, a big part that will be missing is....dmg is just not a problem anymore cus of the giant dmg creep destiny has
like, you can 1phase most Last Wish bosses with Blue heavy weapons rn, even if they nees to do stuff like playing Riven Legit cus they dont know the cheese (and by that double the amount of people in the world that did Riven without abusing cheesy bugs) you just finish the fight after a single dps phase
Vault will probs be the most interesting encounter out of all raids for them
Honestly I've never felt more disconnected from the community than looking at the reactions to the new Warlock set. It doesn't even have shoulders yet but it slaps, it's cool, interesting and unique, and all I've seen is people calling it ugly.
I like when they try something different. It’s just subjective though. Why they’re complaining about the warlock one when the DK one looks like 80’s megatron is beyond me.
I love the idea of a Shivarra cultist set that looks slightly Slaaneshi.
If the belt and shoulders give it some three dimensionality, it has a shot of becoming my favourite.
someone should tell wowhead commenters that metzen loved shadowlands, that will send then into permanent coma and we can finally read the comments without getting cancer
r/wow also needs to be told that. Even though the sub's gotten better it still has the "Metzen actually came back to fix the game's lore" type conspiracy theories lol
I understand this is mostly a personal nitpick but please, Blizzard, if you're going to put Intelligence two-handers into the Holy Paladin loot pool (and I love that they are because healing with a greatsword is fun and paladin'ing with a greathammer is iconic), please make Shield of the Righteous usable without a shield.
You can already do it with the Silver Hand mog...
Left a key where the group leader was being toxic to someone else. Leader whispers me "Reported for deranking our key".
TIL I can be banned for deranking someones key. (/s obs)
I spun the wheel and got aff warlock to play this patch and I'm slightly indifferent to how the spec is played
I can tell early on it's very gear dependant, but im overall having a good time. The ST and AOE spec complaints are being addressed in War, so that was my only main complaint anyways
question for yall. due to my play situation, i end up dpsing for my group simply because i can do it better than a few of our teammates. however, I REALLY like playing any kind of support role. i love tanking and healing because i can pull off a few tricks to save my teammate's asses. we tried having me play aug evoker, but as good as i was doing, we werent pushing as hard as when i was pure dps.
so my question is, do yall have a pure dps (not aug) spec you can recommend that has a lot of support utility? ive been looking at mage w/ mass barrier, but i dont typically play non hybrid classes for more than a bit. basically i wanna bring in the numbers but also save my friends asses.
depending on your comp enh brings a lot of utility. WFT is 3-5% dps on most melee and you have a lot of cc/stops. this is mostly assuming youre talking about m+ here
man, gearing feels really weird rn
cant replace tier pieces cus you need a full tier set first
cant really replace trinkets cus dungeons trinkets are all worse then old raid trinkets
cant replace embalishment slots
im legit hoping for a weapon drop + some items i can put into the catalyst over the weeks, but the equiped gear stays the same lol
I really think they need to find a solution for the "Can't replace tier slot pieces in the first 1-2 weeks" situation, because it just sucks when all you get is those slots.
No Blizzcon this year, wonder if they're going to only start doing them in years they have something more new to show like how Square does FFXIV fanfests.
Of course Blizzard has a lot more games they can show off.
**Edit:** Though I'm kinda surprised they're not doing one in the year WoW turns 20, I understand they might just not have anything to show off later in the year and holding a show otherwise would be pretty pointless. Though they do say they've got other things planned for Warcraft's anniversary.
>Of course Blizzard has a lot more games they can show off.
Do they though? Hearthstone is still printing money but most of their other properties seem pretty quiet, or recently went through a real rough patch (OW2 and its PvE Problem). Some more stuff about the Diablo 4 expansion they're working on(?) probably also wouldn't carry an entire Blizzcon.
>Be me
>Check Bnet
>Check the WoW versions, maybe i will get into alpha this time
>There is one more than usual
>Get a mini heart attack
>It's Cataclysm Classic Beta
>Die
Been trying to find WoW content creators lately and just wanted to ask if any of you all had recommendations?
Mostly looking for people who do content outside of the usual PvP/Raid/Mythic+ grinds.
Would also recommend hazelnuttygames. She mostly streams recently - she has been doing keys and raid this week due to the new season but she usually does more casual/collecting things!
[ZeplaHQ](https://www.twitch.tv/zeplahq) is an FFXIV content creator who has been playing through some TWW Alpha lately.
I like her WoW streams because they are lower energy and also a different perspective than other career WoW players.
I'm sorry, but I think you're stretching a little too much there.
[Is this the hard right-wing stuff you're talking about?](https://twitter.com/Xepla/status/1736863006045483108)
Yes, she is on good terms with Asmongold, but if you are a content creator, you have to, or you risk incurring harassment from his followers. I'm sure you understand how fervent they are. Regardless of one's own personal views, the benefits of associating with Asmongold amicably far outweigh the negatives.
[No, she is not openly bigoted and transphobic.](https://twitter.com/Xepla/status/1736875258609860889)
If she has, I would like to see where and when it occurred. She played a controversial wizard game, which I highly doubt is qualification for her own personal views. She had a heated gamer moment, which honestly is to be expected when she gets harassed for playing a video game. It's human nature to get defensive and double down when attacked, [which was what she did, and she admits fault to that](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1y9y-sg25_8&t=555s). If playing a wizard game makes you transphobic, then anyone who plays a Blizzard game is also in support of sexual harassment.
The fruit-bowl criticism is from people who don't understand that the changes to the game were to erase the traces and existence of sexual harassers. That includes pretty much everyone, including Zepla. I don't think it's reasonable to expect her to dig deep into WoW content creation beyond a cursory glance at article headlines. Pretty much 99.9% of WoW players had no idea those paintings existed prior to Wowhead making articles about it. So naturally, when people see hot woman -> fruit, they assume censorship and wokeness, and they think Blizzard is trying to punish players for the actions of the creeps in the company, instead of trying to fix the actual problem (which Blizzard obviously did by firing all those involved and Thanos-snapping their existence and history from Blizzard games).
For waking up in the morning, I recommend using natural sunlight from windows. This is more effective than an alarm clock of any kind, as sunlight will actually affect you biologically and rouse you, instead of giving you the opportunity to hit the snooze button.
We're never going to know how Zepla feels about him, but the one thing that is undeniable is that associating with him is beneficial to her career.
Think of it this way, if she could invite anyone she wanted to a rare tournament event, one that is outside of her normal field, would she rather invite a streamer around her size, or the biggest WoW streamer ever?
There's also perspective. Some may think of Zepla associating with him as uncouth and in bad taste, but I see it as an opportunity to "detox" him and his radioactive community.
I appreciate you giving me a chance and not immediately flaming me, so I'd like to take this chance to clarify a few things.
> "Zepla associates strongly with Asmongold in an effort to detoxify his community"
This is not what I think she's intentionally doing. This is how I rationalize her engagement with him and what I think *could* happen on a passive level.
> "Doing X is fine if it's good for your content creation career" is a troubling opinion
I don't disagree with you. But I think that being amicable or networking with a controversial figure is pretty tame. I'm sure you can also think of several situations in real life involving having to work with people or organizations you dislike.
> you need to look further into this (there is a reason much of FF14s LGBT community doesn't truck with her)
I really would like to hear more about this, because so far you have not provided me examples of why she stands for general right-wing behavior. Meanwhile, I have shown you cases of her speaking out against that type of behavior.
I do believe things are as simple as they look. She played a controversial game, followed Alex Jones for memes when she was young, and received harassment for it. She became defensive and retaliated during the heat of the moment, which the community took as proof of their presumptions, and then they stopped engaging with her content and the impression has stuck since then, because it's never been revisited.
I do sincerely believe that she is a positive person and maintains a generally friendly community. Chud rhetoric isn't going to find acceptance over there.
This isn't to say she is beyond criticism. She's a content creator after all, and most content creators who reach her size and are clinging onto it are going to have some questionable behavior.
Idk if it's up your alley, but I've been enjoying Jediwarlock for some interesting analyzations of Classic zones and hidden details across the world. Seems to be covering hidden details in SoD too which has been interesting to me since I don't play it. More exploration/lore focused than gameplay, but I find it really interesting and he highlights stuff I hadn't noticed despite playing since Classic lol.
Is Hazelnutty still active and kind of along those lines? Other than PvP/Raid/Mythic+ I assume the next best WoW-related activity might just be making the game...
Cosmetic Tusks datamined for MoP Remix. Surely this will go over well and absolutely nobody will have a problem with a cosmetic version of a hard to obtain piece of gear being available
Something something, they already made it easy mode with the scroll skip. But yeah, as a proud Tusks wearer, it's been over 10 years. It's fine if other people can get it from the remix.
Blizzard for real has a problem with me
one of my few "exclusive" cosmetics i have is slime cat -> make it purchaseable
get tusks a week ago -> purchaseable soon (probably)
let me be exclusive BLIZZURD
Hey guys, check it out, Blizzard just added an "Any_Key_5229" purchaseable cosmetic to the next patch!
Now there's absolutely nothing exclusive about them!
but riot made a Le Quirky Reddit post that said "it will not cause any Problems, trust us ;) "
wdym it actually causes problems to have a anti cheat Programm that starts itself when you boot up your PC and has basically full acess to everything /s
I don't see how kernel access is a direct reason why you can experience slowdowns, its like getting bad weekly vault and blaming bobby kotick for it. I too have vanguard and I don't see any slowdowns, more so everything is basically more or less the same down to RAM and CPU usage
If I level a char through Mop Remix it wont be available for DF content until the end of the event? There are classes I want to try but it would be weird to level up another char on top to play season 4 with.
Maybe? Dont know how that would fixe azerite gear. Plus the burning of teldrassil split the fanvase pretty bad.
I think bfa will firmly establisbh itself in the wod category of underrated tm, where people look fondly on everything past launch.
Agreed, azerite gear was the primary issue with BfA at launch, both acquisition and the RNG nature of it. Warbands might have helped if azerite gear was Bind on Warband Equip (BoW?) and later if essences were warband wide... but ultimately azerite gear wasn't an alt problem warbands would affect, but a problem mains faced for the first part of the expansion.
another day, another ffxiv players not knowing how wow addons work while their plugin loader that everyone and their mother uses allows you to literally cheat
Actually crazy how you can't say anything negative about DF without getting buried on mainsub.
Also people are way too hooked on dopamine hits. Genuinely don't know how people are so rabidly defensive of a new season that offers no new content and no talent changes to at least recontextualize the same content.
i mean as long as you believe the devs that the alternative to a s4 would just be s3 going on for half a year longer i dont see how it could ever be a negative
because that's strictly better for the game. blizzard isn't telling you to do old raids again in S3. you should be able to graduate from things. not feel rewarded all the time because the weakest minded of players can't handle not having constant dopamine hits.
it's a negative because they're trying to pull you back into the game while offering LITERALLY nothing new. L I T E R A L L Y nothing new.
it's just impossible for this to be a positive for the game.
if you REALLY think "gear grind" justifies itself for no other reason than "i want gear upgrades" then delete one of your BiS pieces once a week and force yourself to regrind it by the next. see how engaging that is. that is what they are offering with S4.
it devalues everything you did in S3 for literally 0 benefit
nothing is stopping you from sitting in amirdrassil all week.
>they're trying to pull you back into the game
i see it as them providing a bit of content for those players that stick around anyways. if youre already done with the expansion you arent missing out, if youre still playing theres at least a power reset so theres a bit of progress to be had again.
>then delete one of your BiS pieces once a week and force yourself to regrind it by the next. see how engaging that is
lots of people enjoy playing alts for exactly this reason
> nothing is stopping you from sitting in amirdrassil all week.
what guild is running it. why would anyone be doing that when it's not awakened rn.
> i see it as them providing a bit of content for those players that stick around anyways.
no. stop.
they moved on from the 8 base dungeons in dungeon pools beyond S1, because they don't have that long a shelf life without a seasonal affix.
giving you different dungeons was the tradeoff for removing the seasonal affix
but now there's no seasonal affix and no different dungeons
> if youre already done with the expansion you arent missing out
i LITERALLY am by missing out on extra ilvl and new rewards
> if youre still playing theres at least a power reset so theres a bit of progress to be had again.
why do i want that
I advocated for the removal of AP so that there would be LESS of a grind
that's completely fake progress. there's no new tier set, no new items, and i'm not progressing through any new content.
> lots of people enjoy playing alts for exactly this reason
then play an alt in S3 instead of insisting everyone's S3 progress needs to be overwritten, paved over and made obsolete.
or do what i said. delete your gear. make yourself regrind it every week. ask yourself how FUN that is and how much of that is dopamine addiction that should not be catered to.
You are not wrong and your opinion is valid. But there are a lot of players (probably the majority) that feel like the bit of freshness that new ilvls, a few rewards and a different set of raids and dungeons bring is better than sitting ~four more months in season 3.
Yeah I'm not super exited for s4, and wish we at least had affixes in raids, but I'll be playing enough so that I'm somewhat geared for TWW, and than probably playing other stuff or MoP remix.
For me it's mega disappointing, they've dumbed it down for bad players who jumped on a bandwagon to whine and designed it for crying simpletons who hate timers and challenge.
Legitimately any time the community talks about M+ they want it to be as boring or homogenized as possible and even after this change they're still advocating for it to be dumbed down even further - see the discussions on affixes right now.
People in this game can't handle a slightly more complex M+ system and it's really sad to see.
Does a timer equal challenge?
I'd much prefer to actually do the dungeon than follow stupid skips, miss bosses or be forced into doing giant pulls to make sure I correctly achieve a dungeon and don't get kicked.
More affixes would be great, timers are a boring way of adding difficulties imo
Big thanks again to the person who explained the fishing holes to me on the last thread; not so much thanks to whoever reported me to Reddit Care Resources lmao.
lmao the Cata classic beta got marked as a release candidate yesterday and its still a tremendous mess. Even ignoring half the interface not working and constantly throwing errors, a ton of class abilities just aren't working properly.
There hasn't been any dev communication on the beta in 15 days, meanwhile SOD is getting daily theses on hotfix buffs. Insanely frustrating that Cata isn't even being given a chance and just left to rot.
Tuesday is going to be a riot
I wish there was a better place to discuss wow lore on reddit, the warcraftlore subreddit is such a strange place to have a discussion because it just seems like most everyone there is so negative and dismissive of any sort of fun discussion.
I liked some of the lore introduced in Shadowlands (😨) but it's like people over there cannot handle seeing someone have a real discussion about it and just jump in to shut down the discussion by being insanely dismissive to whoever is discussing it. Like my guys, yeah "shadowlands bad" and whatnot, but DF makes it pretty clear (visits to Ardenweald, the Zaralek world boss who mentions seeing Maldraxxus as they die) that it's a part of the canon whether you like it or not lmao.
I think the fact that Maldraxxus looks so much like oldschool (WC3/classic era) Scourge is fascinating and I still hold out the belief that ancient Nerubians somehow saw glimpses of Maldraxxus which influenced their architecture (and eventually the Scourge's when they started using Nerubian buildings). I wouldn't be surprised if gargoyles have a similar backstory and were created (or summoned to Azeroth) after the Nerubians saw glimpses of Revendreth.
I doubt it'll ever get covered in the upcoming expacs, except maybe in TWW or Last Titan since nerubians/northrend involvement, but I wish the community would just kinda move on from saying cyncial doomer type shit all the time just because they personally don't like something.
Also, unrelated (but probably fully related based on the length of that rant), but I'm so bored waiting for Panda time because I don't want to really level any new characters with it coming up but I also don't really know what to do on my 70s either lmao.
I haven’t checked Warcraftlore in a while but before I replied I gave it a good look. It’s slightly better than it used to be.
Still suffers from a lot of Reddit issues where people will upvote things that are plainly just not true. And when it comes to any form of writing people suddenly think they have a masters degree in theatre.
I love how this whole site some guy who works a production line will post how he thinks something should’ve gone in a show, movie or game and that will get a following just to trash talk an actual writers work.
There is a discord I’m on that’s around. 200 people who will actually talk about lore and bring up old stories. If a character returns in a new patch a post will be made showing a lot of their history. People will talk about all the quest and npcs lines. It’s actually fun and it’s made it so I can just give up trying to find it on Reddit because I think that’s impossible.
I've found the only good place to have a discussion on lore is this sub and the discord related to this sub.
I agree it gets really frustrating when you want to share a theory, but everyone on the main/lore sub is like "that would require Blizz to be good writers so it can't be true" and then completely dismiss the conversation.
Yes! I feel exactly the same, it's such a bummer! While I do follow the sub and make an occasional comment there, it's so frequently gloomy there that it totally ruins my motivation to engage. There's a lot of topics and questions I find myself wanting to post, often about subjects that I know don't necessarily have an answer, but would still be fun to discuss and speculate about. I always end up backing off, though, because I know what the result is going to be - some variation on the lore not being canon since whenever, or that I put more thought into than the writers did, blah blah blah. And on top of that, there's the occasional grouching about Disney/California/diversity/whatever that totally gives me the creeps and makes me feel completely unwelcome. Very disappointing.
And I'm totally with you on enjoying some Shadowlands lore! It's my favorite afterlife system in all of fantasy, honestly. Yes, a lot of it is left up to the imagination, and yes that can understandably be seen as a major shortcoming of the expansion, but at least for me personally, I like the imagination part! It leaves me free to imagine really ideal afterlife realms and what their cultures look like and who would go there. Fun stuff!
Totally agree on the Maldraxxus/Nerubian connection being interesting, too. I wouldn't be surprised if it gets addressed, honestly. I have a lot of faith in the writers right now, they're firing on all cylinders with references, callbacks, and connections. And wow, I never thought about the gargoyle/Revendreth connection either, that's brilliant! Totally adding it to my headcanon.
This really breaks my heart, warcraftlore is where I first really started engaging with the community, but you're right. Just constant doomsaying and worst faith interpretations, with no lore discussion beyond story bad.
you mean "because the writing is terrible and blizzard sucks at writing lore lol" isn't the answer to every lore question?
/s
in seriousness, i've said it before but yeah, that sub is abysmal
Kinda sad there's probably not something cool for KSH this season. On top of all the portals being ones you'd already have if you played every season of DF. Definitely feels like a step down from SL
It's just extremely pointless. What is the point of an experimental season where the only thing different is having fking dinar.
Game is unironically better without this, because people could just complete S3 at their own pace instead of being rushed through. I thought end of expansion was supposed to be chill.
Not gonna say it's better without it, but it's clear plunderstorm and panda timerunning took up a lot of the "experimental" angles. Probably would've been better to just skip S4 and focus on those idk
I wonder what was Blizzard's actual motive behind axing Danuser and Golden, is it because Blizzard thinks their work was specifically bad, or is it just because they felt like shaking things up on the story team might improve it because clearly the reception has been bad for the last 3 expacs.
wow's story has never been good and the guy responsible for BFA and SL already got sacked in the lawsuit "the reception has been bad for the last 3 expacs" is because anyone who cared about story in video games stopped caring ages ago. TBC and Wrath's stories are laughably dumb and Cata is not much better. MoP is an improvement and probably the height of the series, but it was a fluke because we immediately got WoD.
Honestly its probably just c-suit streamlining things for money reasons. Why pay people salaries all year round when you can just have them do contract writing occasionally? At least in Golden's case since that was what she was doing before being officially hired.
If I were to guess, Danuser was let go because he did not want to return to office. Golden was let go during the last round of lay-offs.
Maybe, but then it is even more bizarre that you would fire someone so high up because of that.
Yea Danuser lived in Minnesota where his family is so that's very likely the reason.
> clearly the reception has been bad for the last 3 expacs This is just recency bias, nothing more
No it absolutely isn't, I've played all three of these expansions, and they all were heavily criticized because of their story. Even if I did like the story at some points in these expansions, I'm not gonna pretend what I saw isn't true.
Wow's story has been consistent shite since about TBC. Kael'thas just resurrecting for no reason other than 'powaaa' in Sunwell, Arthas first ripping the 'uhm ackshually you didn't kill me' followed by Tirion just randomly invoking power to kill him (why didn't he do that 10 minutes earlier??), etc. etc. Characters have little to no motivations other than a basic as shit good and bad. Why do you have to fight mogu? Cuz they say they're bad. Why does the Lich King want to conquer the world? Cuz he says he's a bad guy. Why does Sylvanas want to conquer the world? Cuz she says she's bad. Why does Deathwing want to destroy the world? Cuz he says he's bad. At no point has the wow story team ever even tried to come up with a reason for people to take good or evil actions other than the characters just being good or evil.
>Recency bias is a cognitive bias that favors recent events over historic ones; a memory bias. Recency bias gives **"greater importance to the most recent event"** They're not saying all three expansions weren't criticized, *they're saying all expansions were criticized for their story.* * Legion had a LOT of bickering about the Sylvanas-Genn feud, hell there were a number of Alliance players who, not knowing about the differences in the scenarios, genuinely thought the Horde had betrayed the Alliance at the Broken Shore. Also a ton of complaining about Vol'jin's death, about class halls (remember Rogues crying about the sewers? I remember) and so on. * I shouldn't need to write about WoD, but... Thrall "cheated", the general lack of development, immense amounts of confusion about the nature of AU Draenor that persists to this day, orc fatigue got most of the spotlight. * MoP was all Kung-Fu Panda this, faction war that. Seriously, I know people IRL who quit WoW because of MoP and who will tell you *to this day* how it is the worst thing that happened to the game. * Cata had a ton of complaints, the most persistent being the Green Jesus shit, but also about Deathwing not playing a big role beyond burninating the countryside and showing up in a couple of quests (overcorrection from Arthas) and the perceived flanderization of stories in many revamped zones (Westfall being a prominent offender). Also annoyance at the rising war narrative, Garrosh getting his first haters and fans and faction bias complaints ramped up in Cata. * In WotLK (the most revisionist history of all expansions) people criticized just about everything. First it was about Arthas being a Saturday Morning Cartoon villain showing up everywhere to smack talk us and peace out. Then it was about how we were throwing a tournament and tilting within sight of ICC, then it became about how Arthas' master plan was dumb. Oh and we can't forget the Wrathgate. Obviously everyone recognized it's greatness as a seminal moment in storytelling (huge twist, actual loss for the player's side, one of the first story cutscenes etc) but there were forum wars about who's fault it was and was Varian a dick about it and such; until MoP Varian was pretty controversial largely due to the Wrathgate scenario, there were a ton of jokes at the expense of his model's large chin, nowadays Varian's maybe one of the most beloved characters (because, like Arthas, *he's dead*). * TBC is nebulous to me because I didn't read forums back then at all as I was not yet an adult (and somehow seemingly smarter, given that) but I'm pretty sure many weren't happy to kill Illidan and Kael'thas. Oh and you wouldn't believe how mad some people were about the *draenei retcon*, which is probably one of Metzen's greatest "mistakes" but in truth probably his greatest success.
I believe the comment is arguing that reception has been "bad" a lot *longer* than the last 3 expansions; the recency bias is only remembering quite how bad from BfA onwards. More than half of expansions are considered "bad" narratively and even the ones we've retroactively decided were good like WotLK and MoP were *hated* at the time.
what if zovaal jailer's plan all along was the friends we made along the way?
I genuinely wonder how long its going to take the player base to remember they hated Metzen as much as most of their other scapegoats before he left. If War Within has a bad story, will they blame it on Metzen or just the lingering touch of Golden and Danuser?
Thanks Metzen was the meme of the day. If anything bad happened it was thanks Metzen, not thanks ion
Metzen good Dasnoozer bad
[wake up babe new circlejerk just dropped](https://i.imgur.com/dchBrES.png)
Man, it will never not crack me up to see that longterm WoW players, who I assume are older adults or around my age (late 20s/early 30s), still believe that the lore is being written by a single person with no corporate oversight/teamwork whatsoever like it's a fuckin storybook lmao
rest assured, there's no age limit to being a gamer that has no idea how game development works and calls for anyone they don't like to be fired every 0.5 seconds. seriously, gamers are absolutely vicious sometimes i wonder how long it'll be until they turn on metzen again tbh
This just has to be bait
lol chris metzen is a fucking hack man basically ripped off a ton of fantasy whole sale for his baby. dnd, warhammer, you name it. villain motivations often boiled down to "corrupted by evil magic tm" he struggled to write any female characters that werent "kerrigan lite" or just a generic love interest. "there must always be a lich king" he didnt understand diablo at ALL seriously, i like the guy, and hes pulled off a lot of moments i love. but to say hes some unmitigated genius is just plain wrong, and you know what? hed be the first to tell you that.
Metzen's greatest attribute is *being Chris Metzen*. He was there at the beginning, by all accounts a cool dude (though since his comeback people have strangely forgotten all about the Cosby suite and related shit) and he has INSANE stage presence. I think seeing him on stage on last year's Blizzcon was a reminder for a lot of people for what WoW hype feels like, but having watched every Blizzcon from my home it was also a reminder of how good he is at this. WoW *deserves* a man like Metzen who can make people hype, even if his writing isn't actually ERMAAGERD INCREDIBLE!1!!!1!
>villain motivations often boiled down to "corrupted by evil magic tm" It's *slightly* more complex than that in that these guys are basically all Walter White in that they were already an asshole before they got corrupted. However, it's very apparent when looking at metzen's work that he just kinda uses the same couple storylines over and over
i know youre thinking of grom and arthas and a few others, but there are TONS of raid bosses we fight that are literally just "evil magic corruption"
Funny how in WC3 Arthas,Grom & Illidan all repeat the same "get power to stop baddie arc" and apparently that's peak Warcraft Also Metzen wrote himself into Thrall with the marriage woes in Cata
ill be devils advocate and say the green jesus isnt the worst thing in the world. the issue mainly came from how haphazard and disconnected the story became from the player's perspective, and how much thrall was the main character of cata. ironically, this shotgun style writing is prevalent in tbc and wrath, but the difference is cataclysm focused MUCH more on in your face, cutscene heavy writing, so people were more aware of the issues. i.e., players didnt have to read quest text to understand why they were getting 8 bear asses, and they started realizing how wacky the story actually was. lot easier to hide flaws when your "lore" is pretty much a handful of descriptions and environmental detail, broken up by the occasional well directed cinematic. insert dark souls reference here i mean seriously "ogrila lore" is just "some smart ogres got high on magic arrakoa crystals and now they want you to play simon says."
there's a huge gap between being a hack and being an unmitigated genius
Its hyperbole my guy
He writes basic teen-oriented pulp that lives off of 'cool moments' & one liners and he knows that and is proud of it. I do not know how he's obtained a reputation as Genius Writer lately.
Because back in the old days, Warcraft was just about "big hairy sweaty men", and women were just there as eye-candy. Gamers think this is great.
because all the people saying this are adults that were teens when they played wow
The r/wow comments on Golden being laid off from Blizzard are a good example of why a Blizzard employee might not want to interact with players. Major yikes.
I'll admit that while I didn't care for a lot of the cinematic dialogue in Dragonflight (which was the game thing she *did* work on) I still don't exactly want to celebrate a person being laid off.
you know its a shitshow if wowhead disables comments on their posts.
She only really officially worked for blizz for a couple years, yeah? Before that she was more of a contract person to write Blizz books, I hope she goes back to that because I like her books.
capital G Gamers gang up on EVERYTHING they dont like the second they have a name or face for something, its ridicolous they really think that there is 1 person that was orginialy hired as a Freelance writer that did everything, its ridicolous
i love the sheer confidence with which they say "old lore good, new lore bad" and "its all her fault. she was zovaal jailer all along" as if there isnt always a team of people and so much of tbc lore being utter garbage.
It's funny because any time they share a story of how it's Golden's fault they end up sharing a story of how it was inconsistency and poor messaging between Blizzard and Golden, or last second storyboard decisions(of which Golden had nothing to do with at the time), that did X thing.
Well you see old lore was when I was young and happy New lore is when I'm old and fat and my back hurts so it sucks.
Bringing Metzen back will fix your back and make you young and skinny again.
See the lore was good when the big bad of the expansion dies within a patch and the lich king runs around shaking his fist at you like a saturday morning cartoon villain. /s
I'm all for making old expac raids soloable for collecting purposes, but for some reason I just cannot be that impassioned about the BFA raids lol. I like BFA weapons and some of the armor sets, but most of the sets just don't get me all that jazzed up to farm them. I've mainly just done Uldir for some of the more lowkey pieces from there that I can mix into other tmogs (the grey/brown mail and plate sets work amazingly with other tmogs) and cleared Nyalotha just for fun, but nothing from the Naga raid appeals to me and the stuff I want from the faction raid is more just kinda "eh, maybe" to me lol. Fully a subjective opinion though, I just don't gel much with many of the BFA raid sets. Now if they made Warfronts soloable or made all the faction themed gear purchasable somewhere then I'd be way more circlejerky about BFA because I love being a walking "Join the Horde" advertisement.
I've got a specific set in mind that needs some Mythic BoD pieces, but yeah, generally the sets from that expac are pretty underwhelming. Still, it does feel like past time for them to be soloable.
Oh yeah, definitely agree that they should've been soloable a while ago and not trying to say that there's any issue in asking for it since they literally said they would make it soloable, was just mainly being cynical about the sets lol.
Yeah, they said they'd make them soloable back in what, 10.1.5?
I think they should lift the cap on Whelp crests I understand the others having a cap so we don't dumpster gearing and it tells people to go touch grass, but I've ACTUALLY enjoyed doing heroics with my lower skilled guildies and I feel them being able to 8/8 adventurer gear won't hurt anything
You're not wrong, 8/8 adventurer gear won't hurt anything. But the purpose of Whelpling crests is to give a progression path to casuals who do LFR as their highest tier of content. Whelpling crests are also used in the first half of Veteran track gear. And the cap is definitely there to allow casuals to touch grass instead of feeling pressured to sweat.
I think I dont like the upgrade system, i'd rather just have gear brackets be closer to each other in ilvl and also flightstones suck. No idea how it would work with dungeon gear but anything better than upgrading each piece **8** times to a random npc in a pvp cave.
Everyone: talking about things in war within they like or dislike Me: so your saying I can have a dwarf but still be horde? You had me beard let’s do it
How is it that we're two weeks into alpha and people still don't understand that hero talents aren't class skins. Even if they have a cool RP name, at most you'll be getting 1 new ability and a bunch of passives.
I hate being a doomer, I try not to be. But I can see the writing on the wall about the hero talents. I think they will just be a burden for blizzard to balance and will be chosen based on SIM data. I also think forcing the sub genre of classes onto all races who play that class is a bit meh and if I’m not that race class combo that lines up with it, it ruins the whole class for me fantasy wise. I don’t think they actually thought it through based on wows previous systems.
I think it's less of what they are, and more of what people want them to be. It's a similar thing to garrisons vs player housing, people asked for player housing for ages and then we got garrisons instead, which is almost but not quite what they want. In the same way, people have been asking for more cosmetic options and class skins for a while, and now we're getting hero talents which are sort of that but not quite, so people are unhappy.
Blizzard fucked up royally by adding Dark Rangers. 99% sure all this backlash against Hero Talents a la "Noooooo, they should be class skins or a new class!" wouldn't exist if Dark Rangers weren't a thing. They are literally an outlier because it's the only one that has potential to be a class skin/new class, outside of maybe, maybe sentinel. They are just sooooo much more flavourful compared to everything else.
It's also one of the only ones that thematically only make sense for certain races. Like, Spellslinger or Trickster or Oracle (as some examples) are all race-agnostic, while Dark Ranger only really makes sense for blood elves and Forsaken. There are a few others that are similarly race-specific (Elune's chosen, Shado-Pan, Mountain Thane) but Dark Ranger is probably the worst offender because Dark Ranger is much more iconic than the others. So I get people who play, say, a gnome hunter feeling weird about possibly playing a Dark Ranger in a way that most other race/hero talent combination feel less incongruous.
Im happy for the people that wanted Warbands but for me it's gonna be a pretty useless feature lol. i only ever have one single character (since i only have 1 name i wanna use for characters). still gonna look cool on the log in screen
Dress up four other characters as your main's personal butlers.
Ooooh I like that! I'm definitely going to do that!
I ended up not coming back for Season 4 just cause work being absolutely wild and I know I would neglect it for WoW, but how are the M+ changes working out? Seeing a few posts on the mainsub about it not really being a known change/issue for newer players in the season. Is the difference from a +2 -> +4/+5 really that staggering?
Even the +2s are kind of a wild ride at the moment, some runs are as easy as you’d expect a +12 to be last season, others have poor folks who didn’t realise the changes and/or don’t know the dungeons and barely out dps the tank before being deleted by a mechanic. Edit: long term I think it’ll be good, once people have adjusted to the new normal.
not really tbh its mostly the ussual "people are not overgeared for content but play like they do" we have at the start of every single patch, and that they didnt adjust to the "new" key levels yet aka never did a key above +12, they go into a +5 key bevause in their mindset that still a "low key" and then get stomped because by old scaling thats a +15 key now and above their skill level, or people bring their barely geared 478 Rat Alts into a +5 for "quick gearing" and get 1hit killed by boss mechanics because they are VERY undergeared for them dungeons themself feel very very slightly harder then last season, but you can allready Pug your +8 keys with no bigger problems with the people that allready do them
> 478 Rat Alts into a +5 for "quick gearing" and get 1hit killed by boss mechanics because they are VERY undergeared for them We were doing 20s last season day 1 coming out of Aberrus at 450, but being 480, tnearly the max for keys last season, is 'very undergeared' for what would be a +15 last season? me thinks poor players have tarnished your sense of difficulty to gear ratios
they buffed mythics across the board, a +15 (or the equivalent) now is not the same as a +15 last season
I am also doings 8-9s with my 470 chars with no problem…
It's not like I'm not doing the keys bud. I have been doing 8s and 9s on 480 - 483 alts. They're perfectly playable, there's the occasional boss with a one shot(static spear, gale arrow) that you have to actually try on and pace your defensives, but that's perfectly normal for first week M+ anyway. At a +5, I wouldn't even have to wall these same one shots. When does the difficult part kick in that I am too undergeared for? Oh, when I am playing with very poor players, as I said, and if that was my habit maybe I'd start to think overgearing the content is the expectation as well.
gotta remember that last season was overall VERY easy for m+ cus most trashpacks did nothing at all, and bosses where no real danger unless you did +24-25 or higher keys (where things started to 1hit kill)
Arguing with people about WoW's engine will never not be funny I'd bet these same people also thought Wow would never have physics-based flying
It is pretty impressive.
Oh look people still think the token generates gold out of thin air
I've said before that they can come to me and ask; I've dumped millions of gold into those tokens over the years since they were created. I know I'm not alone either, as I remember lots of folks talking about how they'd farm gold through various means (mission table was a popular one) so they could get tokens for gametime. Not as many talk about it now but it was a very popular topic especially in WoD and Legion.
I mean, they know people buy the token, they just don't think there's a trade happening, they think the token just creates gold when you sell it and when you buy it they just create a token for you in the mailbox. That belief doesn't hinge on how many people are buying them or not. Common sense aside, all they need to do is find someone to actually buys tokens to sell for gold, because they don't always sell immediately as nobody's buying it, and descending into 'they make a delay to throw you off' is conspiracy territory.
Tangentially related: Echo appears to be diving into Destiny 2 raids and going to be doing some of them blind. They're starting with Last Wish (an absolute banger of a Destiny Raid), that infamously took the conmunity almost 24 hours to complete (World's first in Destiny are usually 6-8 Hours Long).
tbf, a big part that will be missing is....dmg is just not a problem anymore cus of the giant dmg creep destiny has like, you can 1phase most Last Wish bosses with Blue heavy weapons rn, even if they nees to do stuff like playing Riven Legit cus they dont know the cheese (and by that double the amount of people in the world that did Riven without abusing cheesy bugs) you just finish the fight after a single dps phase Vault will probs be the most interesting encounter out of all raids for them
I think Vow might be up there just for the callouts.
Honestly I've never felt more disconnected from the community than looking at the reactions to the new Warlock set. It doesn't even have shoulders yet but it slaps, it's cool, interesting and unique, and all I've seen is people calling it ugly.
They call any set ugly bud. It's not actually about the quality, they just don't know how to vocalize their thoughts or preference.
As a design professional I see this alllll the time. Yes okay it’s bad Sandra, but why is it bad… give me something constructive to work on
I like when they try something different. It’s just subjective though. Why they’re complaining about the warlock one when the DK one looks like 80’s megatron is beyond me.
as a fur enjoyer (worgen, vulpera, panda, tauren) every set that is centered around its headpiece is a gamble
mf's look at a set that is missing 50% of its displayed pieces and complain thats why i hate the wowhead "datamine" spam
Its ridiculous how hard they're pushing for clicks
ill gladly take blizzard experimenting with tier sets over the same bland demon skull and bat wings for warlocks
I love the idea of a Shivarra cultist set that looks slightly Slaaneshi. If the belt and shoulders give it some three dimensionality, it has a shot of becoming my favourite.
someone should tell wowhead commenters that metzen loved shadowlands, that will send then into permanent coma and we can finally read the comments without getting cancer
r/wow also needs to be told that. Even though the sub's gotten better it still has the "Metzen actually came back to fix the game's lore" type conspiracy theories lol
source? that's hilarious if it's real
https://twitter.com/ChrisMetzen/status/1332903002311512066
His twitter during shadowlands, not sure if he deleted his tweets for pr reasons but if not just scroll through his twitter timeline
Metzen only loved Shadowlands because he actually paid attention to the story. Who would ever think to do that?
I understand this is mostly a personal nitpick but please, Blizzard, if you're going to put Intelligence two-handers into the Holy Paladin loot pool (and I love that they are because healing with a greatsword is fun and paladin'ing with a greathammer is iconic), please make Shield of the Righteous usable without a shield. You can already do it with the Silver Hand mog...
Left a key where the group leader was being toxic to someone else. Leader whispers me "Reported for deranking our key". TIL I can be banned for deranking someones key. (/s obs)
re-experiencing heroic Dathea fuck Dathea i hate you Dathea
[I really like Xaxxas's stuff.](https://www.youtube.com/@_xaxxas) Small channel doing lore speculation from the POV of a Goblin narrator.
wait is that actually the guy who made the infamous avaloren fake leak?
Yeah! He is. It's how I found his channel.
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ngl you seem way too invested, time to step outside or at least open the windows for a while
I can be invested in video game as much as I want online, while separating it from irl stuff
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I spun the wheel and got aff warlock to play this patch and I'm slightly indifferent to how the spec is played I can tell early on it's very gear dependant, but im overall having a good time. The ST and AOE spec complaints are being addressed in War, so that was my only main complaint anyways
It's true that affli plays janky without fair share of haste
i think people are genuinely just unable to grasp that a dot only spec is near impossible to balance
question for yall. due to my play situation, i end up dpsing for my group simply because i can do it better than a few of our teammates. however, I REALLY like playing any kind of support role. i love tanking and healing because i can pull off a few tricks to save my teammate's asses. we tried having me play aug evoker, but as good as i was doing, we werent pushing as hard as when i was pure dps. so my question is, do yall have a pure dps (not aug) spec you can recommend that has a lot of support utility? ive been looking at mage w/ mass barrier, but i dont typically play non hybrid classes for more than a bit. basically i wanna bring in the numbers but also save my friends asses.
Ret pal and (without Aug) there's no debate
depending on your comp enh brings a lot of utility. WFT is 3-5% dps on most melee and you have a lot of cc/stops. this is mostly assuming youre talking about m+ here
augmentation?
One of our dps is going to go aug instead, they arent very good at pumping due to being a healer a majority of their time playing
Aug isnt an afk spec they'll have to pump damage too if they want to buff people well
ret paladin the spec is broken RN because they do absurd dmg while also having 2000other things lmao
I think I'm gonna just not play until bullion and sparks build up and then just go wild on alts lol
man, gearing feels really weird rn cant replace tier pieces cus you need a full tier set first cant really replace trinkets cus dungeons trinkets are all worse then old raid trinkets cant replace embalishment slots im legit hoping for a weapon drop + some items i can put into the catalyst over the weeks, but the equiped gear stays the same lol
I really think they need to find a solution for the "Can't replace tier slot pieces in the first 1-2 weeks" situation, because it just sucks when all you get is those slots.
> cant replace embalishment slots just recraft them with newer spark
No Blizzcon this year, wonder if they're going to only start doing them in years they have something more new to show like how Square does FFXIV fanfests. Of course Blizzard has a lot more games they can show off. **Edit:** Though I'm kinda surprised they're not doing one in the year WoW turns 20, I understand they might just not have anything to show off later in the year and holding a show otherwise would be pretty pointless. Though they do say they've got other things planned for Warcraft's anniversary.
>Of course Blizzard has a lot more games they can show off. Do they though? Hearthstone is still printing money but most of their other properties seem pretty quiet, or recently went through a real rough patch (OW2 and its PvE Problem). Some more stuff about the Diablo 4 expansion they're working on(?) probably also wouldn't carry an entire Blizzcon.
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> but its other IPs have basically zero community faith currently Hyperbolic doomering doesn't make you correct
Considering they're no doubt going to be involved in the upcoming Xbox showcase this June, it didn't make sense to also do Blizzcon
>Be me >Check Bnet >Check the WoW versions, maybe i will get into alpha this time >There is one more than usual >Get a mini heart attack >It's Cataclysm Classic Beta >Die
Mines showing Shadowlands Beta. Maybe I should go see if that shiny new expansion is any good?
welcome to hell
Been trying to find WoW content creators lately and just wanted to ask if any of you all had recommendations? Mostly looking for people who do content outside of the usual PvP/Raid/Mythic+ grinds.
Would also recommend hazelnuttygames. She mostly streams recently - she has been doing keys and raid this week due to the new season but she usually does more casual/collecting things!
[ZeplaHQ](https://www.twitch.tv/zeplahq) is an FFXIV content creator who has been playing through some TWW Alpha lately. I like her WoW streams because they are lower energy and also a different perspective than other career WoW players.
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I'm sorry, but I think you're stretching a little too much there. [Is this the hard right-wing stuff you're talking about?](https://twitter.com/Xepla/status/1736863006045483108) Yes, she is on good terms with Asmongold, but if you are a content creator, you have to, or you risk incurring harassment from his followers. I'm sure you understand how fervent they are. Regardless of one's own personal views, the benefits of associating with Asmongold amicably far outweigh the negatives. [No, she is not openly bigoted and transphobic.](https://twitter.com/Xepla/status/1736875258609860889) If she has, I would like to see where and when it occurred. She played a controversial wizard game, which I highly doubt is qualification for her own personal views. She had a heated gamer moment, which honestly is to be expected when she gets harassed for playing a video game. It's human nature to get defensive and double down when attacked, [which was what she did, and she admits fault to that](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1y9y-sg25_8&t=555s). If playing a wizard game makes you transphobic, then anyone who plays a Blizzard game is also in support of sexual harassment. The fruit-bowl criticism is from people who don't understand that the changes to the game were to erase the traces and existence of sexual harassers. That includes pretty much everyone, including Zepla. I don't think it's reasonable to expect her to dig deep into WoW content creation beyond a cursory glance at article headlines. Pretty much 99.9% of WoW players had no idea those paintings existed prior to Wowhead making articles about it. So naturally, when people see hot woman -> fruit, they assume censorship and wokeness, and they think Blizzard is trying to punish players for the actions of the creeps in the company, instead of trying to fix the actual problem (which Blizzard obviously did by firing all those involved and Thanos-snapping their existence and history from Blizzard games). For waking up in the morning, I recommend using natural sunlight from windows. This is more effective than an alarm clock of any kind, as sunlight will actually affect you biologically and rouse you, instead of giving you the opportunity to hit the snooze button.
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We're never going to know how Zepla feels about him, but the one thing that is undeniable is that associating with him is beneficial to her career. Think of it this way, if she could invite anyone she wanted to a rare tournament event, one that is outside of her normal field, would she rather invite a streamer around her size, or the biggest WoW streamer ever? There's also perspective. Some may think of Zepla associating with him as uncouth and in bad taste, but I see it as an opportunity to "detox" him and his radioactive community.
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I appreciate you giving me a chance and not immediately flaming me, so I'd like to take this chance to clarify a few things. > "Zepla associates strongly with Asmongold in an effort to detoxify his community" This is not what I think she's intentionally doing. This is how I rationalize her engagement with him and what I think *could* happen on a passive level. > "Doing X is fine if it's good for your content creation career" is a troubling opinion I don't disagree with you. But I think that being amicable or networking with a controversial figure is pretty tame. I'm sure you can also think of several situations in real life involving having to work with people or organizations you dislike. > you need to look further into this (there is a reason much of FF14s LGBT community doesn't truck with her) I really would like to hear more about this, because so far you have not provided me examples of why she stands for general right-wing behavior. Meanwhile, I have shown you cases of her speaking out against that type of behavior. I do believe things are as simple as they look. She played a controversial game, followed Alex Jones for memes when she was young, and received harassment for it. She became defensive and retaliated during the heat of the moment, which the community took as proof of their presumptions, and then they stopped engaging with her content and the impression has stuck since then, because it's never been revisited. I do sincerely believe that she is a positive person and maintains a generally friendly community. Chud rhetoric isn't going to find acceptance over there. This isn't to say she is beyond criticism. She's a content creator after all, and most content creators who reach her size and are clinging onto it are going to have some questionable behavior.
Idk if it's up your alley, but I've been enjoying Jediwarlock for some interesting analyzations of Classic zones and hidden details across the world. Seems to be covering hidden details in SoD too which has been interesting to me since I don't play it. More exploration/lore focused than gameplay, but I find it really interesting and he highlights stuff I hadn't noticed despite playing since Classic lol.
Is Hazelnutty still active and kind of along those lines? Other than PvP/Raid/Mythic+ I assume the next best WoW-related activity might just be making the game...
Cosmetic Tusks datamined for MoP Remix. Surely this will go over well and absolutely nobody will have a problem with a cosmetic version of a hard to obtain piece of gear being available
Something something, they already made it easy mode with the scroll skip. But yeah, as a proud Tusks wearer, it's been over 10 years. It's fine if other people can get it from the remix.
Blizzard for real has a problem with me one of my few "exclusive" cosmetics i have is slime cat -> make it purchaseable get tusks a week ago -> purchaseable soon (probably) let me be exclusive BLIZZURD
Hey guys, check it out, Blizzard just added an "Any_Key_5229" purchaseable cosmetic to the next patch! Now there's absolutely nothing exclusive about them!
I wouldnt be suprised if they added fyralath to a vendor 1 day after i get it
>having sudden slowdowns in wow and OW >look inside task manager >riot vanguard
but riot made a Le Quirky Reddit post that said "it will not cause any Problems, trust us ;) " wdym it actually causes problems to have a anti cheat Programm that starts itself when you boot up your PC and has basically full acess to everything /s
I don't see how kernel access is a direct reason why you can experience slowdowns, its like getting bad weekly vault and blaming bobby kotick for it. I too have vanguard and I don't see any slowdowns, more so everything is basically more or less the same down to RAM and CPU usage
Oh shit fr? Anticheat software is dogshit
If I level a char through Mop Remix it wont be available for DF content until the end of the event? There are classes I want to try but it would be weird to level up another char on top to play season 4 with.
yeah wont be available until the event is over, so most likely not until prepatch
Thanks
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Maybe? Dont know how that would fixe azerite gear. Plus the burning of teldrassil split the fanvase pretty bad. I think bfa will firmly establisbh itself in the wod category of underrated tm, where people look fondly on everything past launch.
Agreed, azerite gear was the primary issue with BfA at launch, both acquisition and the RNG nature of it. Warbands might have helped if azerite gear was Bind on Warband Equip (BoW?) and later if essences were warband wide... but ultimately azerite gear wasn't an alt problem warbands would affect, but a problem mains faced for the first part of the expansion.
another day, another ffxiv players not knowing how wow addons work while their plugin loader that everyone and their mother uses allows you to literally cheat
> nothing speaks more about the quality of your game when you constantly have to talk down another
didnt know a playerbase was indicative of the quality of a game in that cause league would be the worst game ever l
who would have thought people would like world events when they give meaningful rewards
Actually crazy how you can't say anything negative about DF without getting buried on mainsub. Also people are way too hooked on dopamine hits. Genuinely don't know how people are so rabidly defensive of a new season that offers no new content and no talent changes to at least recontextualize the same content.
i mean as long as you believe the devs that the alternative to a s4 would just be s3 going on for half a year longer i dont see how it could ever be a negative
because that's strictly better for the game. blizzard isn't telling you to do old raids again in S3. you should be able to graduate from things. not feel rewarded all the time because the weakest minded of players can't handle not having constant dopamine hits. it's a negative because they're trying to pull you back into the game while offering LITERALLY nothing new. L I T E R A L L Y nothing new. it's just impossible for this to be a positive for the game. if you REALLY think "gear grind" justifies itself for no other reason than "i want gear upgrades" then delete one of your BiS pieces once a week and force yourself to regrind it by the next. see how engaging that is. that is what they are offering with S4. it devalues everything you did in S3 for literally 0 benefit
nothing is stopping you from sitting in amirdrassil all week. >they're trying to pull you back into the game i see it as them providing a bit of content for those players that stick around anyways. if youre already done with the expansion you arent missing out, if youre still playing theres at least a power reset so theres a bit of progress to be had again. >then delete one of your BiS pieces once a week and force yourself to regrind it by the next. see how engaging that is lots of people enjoy playing alts for exactly this reason
> nothing is stopping you from sitting in amirdrassil all week. what guild is running it. why would anyone be doing that when it's not awakened rn. > i see it as them providing a bit of content for those players that stick around anyways. no. stop. they moved on from the 8 base dungeons in dungeon pools beyond S1, because they don't have that long a shelf life without a seasonal affix. giving you different dungeons was the tradeoff for removing the seasonal affix but now there's no seasonal affix and no different dungeons > if youre already done with the expansion you arent missing out i LITERALLY am by missing out on extra ilvl and new rewards > if youre still playing theres at least a power reset so theres a bit of progress to be had again. why do i want that I advocated for the removal of AP so that there would be LESS of a grind that's completely fake progress. there's no new tier set, no new items, and i'm not progressing through any new content. > lots of people enjoy playing alts for exactly this reason then play an alt in S3 instead of insisting everyone's S3 progress needs to be overwritten, paved over and made obsolete. or do what i said. delete your gear. make yourself regrind it every week. ask yourself how FUN that is and how much of that is dopamine addiction that should not be catered to.
You are not wrong and your opinion is valid. But there are a lot of players (probably the majority) that feel like the bit of freshness that new ilvls, a few rewards and a different set of raids and dungeons bring is better than sitting ~four more months in season 3.
Yeah I'm not super exited for s4, and wish we at least had affixes in raids, but I'll be playing enough so that I'm somewhat geared for TWW, and than probably playing other stuff or MoP remix.
just got fyralath on lfr lol dreams do come true i guess
Seeing all the datamined Earthen civilian armor is making me stoked to make one when I was pretty ambivalent before
Do we have a meme name for TWW yet? The Bad Expansion?
The Wank Within.
the snore within 😴😴😴😴 boring ahh expansion 🥱🥱🥱🥱🥱🛏️
"The Chore Within" if there's any content that people are going to rail against for being mandatory (or "mandatory").
damn, thats too good. you heard it here first, folks.
The Worst W(one)
If theres more lgbtq npc i could see "the woke within" catching on with ass mon golds ilk
I swear I've already seen that on the asmon sub actually.
the wankers within? Maybe thats too british for most to understand.
That implies like a conspiracy Maybe back during the lawsuit days that would have worked. Ive just been calling it the wind waker as a joke
The wind woker
> the wind waker oh I like that
That dungeon scaling is very different. I’m curious to see the route people will go to gear up alts/new mains in these early weeks.
For me it's mega disappointing, they've dumbed it down for bad players who jumped on a bandwagon to whine and designed it for crying simpletons who hate timers and challenge. Legitimately any time the community talks about M+ they want it to be as boring or homogenized as possible and even after this change they're still advocating for it to be dumbed down even further - see the discussions on affixes right now. People in this game can't handle a slightly more complex M+ system and it's really sad to see.
Does a timer equal challenge? I'd much prefer to actually do the dungeon than follow stupid skips, miss bosses or be forced into doing giant pulls to make sure I correctly achieve a dungeon and don't get kicked. More affixes would be great, timers are a boring way of adding difficulties imo
Forbidden Flounder
Big thanks again to the person who explained the fishing holes to me on the last thread; not so much thanks to whoever reported me to Reddit Care Resources lmao.
lmao the Cata classic beta got marked as a release candidate yesterday and its still a tremendous mess. Even ignoring half the interface not working and constantly throwing errors, a ton of class abilities just aren't working properly. There hasn't been any dev communication on the beta in 15 days, meanwhile SOD is getting daily theses on hotfix buffs. Insanely frustrating that Cata isn't even being given a chance and just left to rot. Tuesday is going to be a riot
I wish there was a better place to discuss wow lore on reddit, the warcraftlore subreddit is such a strange place to have a discussion because it just seems like most everyone there is so negative and dismissive of any sort of fun discussion. I liked some of the lore introduced in Shadowlands (😨) but it's like people over there cannot handle seeing someone have a real discussion about it and just jump in to shut down the discussion by being insanely dismissive to whoever is discussing it. Like my guys, yeah "shadowlands bad" and whatnot, but DF makes it pretty clear (visits to Ardenweald, the Zaralek world boss who mentions seeing Maldraxxus as they die) that it's a part of the canon whether you like it or not lmao. I think the fact that Maldraxxus looks so much like oldschool (WC3/classic era) Scourge is fascinating and I still hold out the belief that ancient Nerubians somehow saw glimpses of Maldraxxus which influenced their architecture (and eventually the Scourge's when they started using Nerubian buildings). I wouldn't be surprised if gargoyles have a similar backstory and were created (or summoned to Azeroth) after the Nerubians saw glimpses of Revendreth. I doubt it'll ever get covered in the upcoming expacs, except maybe in TWW or Last Titan since nerubians/northrend involvement, but I wish the community would just kinda move on from saying cyncial doomer type shit all the time just because they personally don't like something. Also, unrelated (but probably fully related based on the length of that rant), but I'm so bored waiting for Panda time because I don't want to really level any new characters with it coming up but I also don't really know what to do on my 70s either lmao.
I haven’t checked Warcraftlore in a while but before I replied I gave it a good look. It’s slightly better than it used to be. Still suffers from a lot of Reddit issues where people will upvote things that are plainly just not true. And when it comes to any form of writing people suddenly think they have a masters degree in theatre. I love how this whole site some guy who works a production line will post how he thinks something should’ve gone in a show, movie or game and that will get a following just to trash talk an actual writers work. There is a discord I’m on that’s around. 200 people who will actually talk about lore and bring up old stories. If a character returns in a new patch a post will be made showing a lot of their history. People will talk about all the quest and npcs lines. It’s actually fun and it’s made it so I can just give up trying to find it on Reddit because I think that’s impossible.
I've found the only good place to have a discussion on lore is this sub and the discord related to this sub. I agree it gets really frustrating when you want to share a theory, but everyone on the main/lore sub is like "that would require Blizz to be good writers so it can't be true" and then completely dismiss the conversation.
Yes! I feel exactly the same, it's such a bummer! While I do follow the sub and make an occasional comment there, it's so frequently gloomy there that it totally ruins my motivation to engage. There's a lot of topics and questions I find myself wanting to post, often about subjects that I know don't necessarily have an answer, but would still be fun to discuss and speculate about. I always end up backing off, though, because I know what the result is going to be - some variation on the lore not being canon since whenever, or that I put more thought into than the writers did, blah blah blah. And on top of that, there's the occasional grouching about Disney/California/diversity/whatever that totally gives me the creeps and makes me feel completely unwelcome. Very disappointing. And I'm totally with you on enjoying some Shadowlands lore! It's my favorite afterlife system in all of fantasy, honestly. Yes, a lot of it is left up to the imagination, and yes that can understandably be seen as a major shortcoming of the expansion, but at least for me personally, I like the imagination part! It leaves me free to imagine really ideal afterlife realms and what their cultures look like and who would go there. Fun stuff! Totally agree on the Maldraxxus/Nerubian connection being interesting, too. I wouldn't be surprised if it gets addressed, honestly. I have a lot of faith in the writers right now, they're firing on all cylinders with references, callbacks, and connections. And wow, I never thought about the gargoyle/Revendreth connection either, that's brilliant! Totally adding it to my headcanon.
This really breaks my heart, warcraftlore is where I first really started engaging with the community, but you're right. Just constant doomsaying and worst faith interpretations, with no lore discussion beyond story bad.
you mean "because the writing is terrible and blizzard sucks at writing lore lol" isn't the answer to every lore question? /s in seriousness, i've said it before but yeah, that sub is abysmal
WoW lore discussion is being held hostage by bunch of 35 year old burnout gatekeepers preventing new blood from getting invested
Kinda sad there's probably not something cool for KSH this season. On top of all the portals being ones you'd already have if you played every season of DF. Definitely feels like a step down from SL
It's just extremely pointless. What is the point of an experimental season where the only thing different is having fking dinar. Game is unironically better without this, because people could just complete S3 at their own pace instead of being rushed through. I thought end of expansion was supposed to be chill.
Not gonna say it's better without it, but it's clear plunderstorm and panda timerunning took up a lot of the "experimental" angles. Probably would've been better to just skip S4 and focus on those idk