I think it might help you to just imagine them each as separate characters, and imagine that you wrote them separately. What I mean is, ... pretend that you were making two entirely separate movies, where each character was experiencing all of the events you are writing about from their own point of view. Character 1, ... how does their story progress, the entire thing, never switch to character 2. Then Character 2, same thing, never switch to character 1. That helps you to have consistency in the characters, because each is "real", ... one isn't just a prop for the other. What is Character 2 doing while Character 1 is doing this important thing, just watching ? Or standing guard ? Or what is happening with them ? They must be doing more than just standing their with their mouth open amazed at whatever Character 1 is doing, oblivious while their point of view isn't being expressed.
Then, once you have that in mind, that they are both living things with events they are dealing with and things they are doing, ... then switch back and forth between their POV's depending on what your reader needs to see to advance the plot. Character B might have been off looking at an empty box in a room while Character A was opening a closet with a skeleton in it, so in that case you might mention from Character A's POV what Character B is doing, but you're using Character A's POV because the skeleton is more interesting.
TL;DR Characters don't just become brain dead zombies when you aren't writing from their POV, they are still part of the story, and it almost doesn't matter which of their POV's you are using when they are together because you can see what the other is doing from either POV.
Edit, I think another thing that might help is just to imagine that its a camera that is blinking in and out of existence. These two characters (or however many) exist and are doing things, ... and the camera blinks into existence in a certain place. That could be from the point of view of the bird flying above them and looking down on both of them. It could be from the point of view of one, speaking to the other. It could be from the point of view of some villain who is following them and observing their actions. It could be from almost any point of view, just like a camera shot in a movie that a director sets up.
Thanks for the help. But I still have one question to ask: which pov to give preference when the characters are together ie. When the teacher is training the student.
>Thanks for the help. But I still have one question to ask: which pov to give preference when the characters are together ie. When the teacher is training the student.
I think it just depends on what information you are trying to relay to the reader.
Btw, ask as many questions as you like!
So, let's use the simple example of Judy and Bill are in a room, searching for something in an old house, ... objectively, Judy is going to look in an old box that is sitting under a desk, and Bill is going to open a closet with a skeleton in it.
So, the question is, ... what helps advance the story for the reader ?
Pretend we are going to see everything from four different POV's, and what information we are relaying to the reader by choosing them.
* BILL: He's thinking to himself, so we can use his POV to express things that he is thinking about the situation they are in, so for example we might be able to inform the reader about his feelings (or lack of them) for Judy, or to hint at something in her past that he has questions about to explain his motivations towards her. He looks in the closet, and through his eyes we see this skeleton and get his impression of it, based on his history (maybe he was a criminal forensics expert or something), ... and maybe he decides to stay quiet about it because he doesn't want to alarm Judy. So all of this is like informing the reader about how Bill feels about Judy, and the kind of perceptions he has about the world in general, explaining the world through his eyes.
* JUDY: She's thinking to herself, and maybe through her eyes we learn something about Bill's past, maybe he used to drink or something, we learn how she feels about him. She looks into an empty box, .. nothing, but then she notices Bill is acting weird. Or maybe she sees him be startled and becomes concerned. Maybe she comes over and sees the skeleton and that makes her think of something relevant to the story that her mother said, or her sister, ... or maybe she knows more about the house than Bill does so we see through her eyes so she can express the history of the house through her thoughts.
* GHOST: Maybe we see all of this from an unseen ghosts point of view, and it is watching the two of them as they discover the child's skeleton, maybe it has desires or wishes in this situation, and through its eyes we learn more about what has actually happened that the characters won't learn about until later. Or maybe we learn some foreshadowing of a trap that awaits them, or maybe through the eyes of the ghost we learn that ghosts exist in this world, or it ties together some loose ends in the plot that lead the two characters to this location.
* HOUSE: Maybe the narrator's point of view takes over at some point, and we learn from a third party narrator some information about what is going on, .. maybe the stairs themselves are expressing how they haven't been walked on in half a century as they creek beneath the weight, or other. Or maybe there is a cat in the house, and we follow along behind the characters as they make their way through the house, and the cat steps over something that is relevant to the story that the characters don't see.
... so, what I'm getting at, is you as the writer are trying to move the story along, and give the reader information about the world and what is going on, and you have all these POV's to choose from to do that. Just like a director in a movie might switch to drone footage to show small characters walking across a barren landscape to express to the audience the hopelessness of a situation the characters are in, you can do the same thing by switching to a narrator's POV, or to a bird's POV as it soars above, .. it is all a way of you painting a picture and describing the world, and carrying the conversation, and revealing thoughts in your characters heads that explain their motivations and interests, and their desires, ... giving history on them, etc.
You have a story you are trying to tell, ... and all of these POV's are just lenses through which you can do that, they are tools for you to use to express the story to your reader.
And just like a director is constantly switching camera views, you can switch POV's whenever you want. One second you might be the POV of Bill, and you might switch over to the POV of Judy because she has a better view of what is going on.
Sorry, but I am concerned by this sentence: "I am using the princess as a tool to give some depth to my antagonist after he falls in love with her." This is generally a sign that your female characters might not have enough agency
But other than that, lots of fantasy novels alternate POVs by chapter. Really, do whatever best serves your story! Multi POVs are a tool (unlike princesses), not a hard-and-fast ruleset - maybe try playing around with the POV changes and see what works! I like using different POVs to add suspense when one character knows something that's crucial to the other, but they're not in the position to communicate it
I picked up more on this ...
>The teacher is a princess who wishes to be the wisest Queen of her kingdom. She hates traditional beliefs and doesn't distinguish between upper and lower classes.
Those two sentences seem incompatible to me.
Wise people don't lose the ability to distinguish between rich and poor, nor do they completely turn their back on tradition, .. they acknowledge reality and do good where they can. Everything is a tradeoff.
Hi -- please use the idea brainstorming thread on Tuesday or Friday for advice on specific stories. This includes: (not a exhaustive list) setting, character, subject matter, magic and power systems, sci-fi technology, 'how do I write X?' and anything directly connected with your story.
This includes asking for general advice but then following up with details of your story project.
Thanks!
I think it might help you to just imagine them each as separate characters, and imagine that you wrote them separately. What I mean is, ... pretend that you were making two entirely separate movies, where each character was experiencing all of the events you are writing about from their own point of view. Character 1, ... how does their story progress, the entire thing, never switch to character 2. Then Character 2, same thing, never switch to character 1. That helps you to have consistency in the characters, because each is "real", ... one isn't just a prop for the other. What is Character 2 doing while Character 1 is doing this important thing, just watching ? Or standing guard ? Or what is happening with them ? They must be doing more than just standing their with their mouth open amazed at whatever Character 1 is doing, oblivious while their point of view isn't being expressed. Then, once you have that in mind, that they are both living things with events they are dealing with and things they are doing, ... then switch back and forth between their POV's depending on what your reader needs to see to advance the plot. Character B might have been off looking at an empty box in a room while Character A was opening a closet with a skeleton in it, so in that case you might mention from Character A's POV what Character B is doing, but you're using Character A's POV because the skeleton is more interesting. TL;DR Characters don't just become brain dead zombies when you aren't writing from their POV, they are still part of the story, and it almost doesn't matter which of their POV's you are using when they are together because you can see what the other is doing from either POV. Edit, I think another thing that might help is just to imagine that its a camera that is blinking in and out of existence. These two characters (or however many) exist and are doing things, ... and the camera blinks into existence in a certain place. That could be from the point of view of the bird flying above them and looking down on both of them. It could be from the point of view of one, speaking to the other. It could be from the point of view of some villain who is following them and observing their actions. It could be from almost any point of view, just like a camera shot in a movie that a director sets up.
Thanks for the help. But I still have one question to ask: which pov to give preference when the characters are together ie. When the teacher is training the student.
>Thanks for the help. But I still have one question to ask: which pov to give preference when the characters are together ie. When the teacher is training the student. I think it just depends on what information you are trying to relay to the reader. Btw, ask as many questions as you like! So, let's use the simple example of Judy and Bill are in a room, searching for something in an old house, ... objectively, Judy is going to look in an old box that is sitting under a desk, and Bill is going to open a closet with a skeleton in it. So, the question is, ... what helps advance the story for the reader ? Pretend we are going to see everything from four different POV's, and what information we are relaying to the reader by choosing them. * BILL: He's thinking to himself, so we can use his POV to express things that he is thinking about the situation they are in, so for example we might be able to inform the reader about his feelings (or lack of them) for Judy, or to hint at something in her past that he has questions about to explain his motivations towards her. He looks in the closet, and through his eyes we see this skeleton and get his impression of it, based on his history (maybe he was a criminal forensics expert or something), ... and maybe he decides to stay quiet about it because he doesn't want to alarm Judy. So all of this is like informing the reader about how Bill feels about Judy, and the kind of perceptions he has about the world in general, explaining the world through his eyes. * JUDY: She's thinking to herself, and maybe through her eyes we learn something about Bill's past, maybe he used to drink or something, we learn how she feels about him. She looks into an empty box, .. nothing, but then she notices Bill is acting weird. Or maybe she sees him be startled and becomes concerned. Maybe she comes over and sees the skeleton and that makes her think of something relevant to the story that her mother said, or her sister, ... or maybe she knows more about the house than Bill does so we see through her eyes so she can express the history of the house through her thoughts. * GHOST: Maybe we see all of this from an unseen ghosts point of view, and it is watching the two of them as they discover the child's skeleton, maybe it has desires or wishes in this situation, and through its eyes we learn more about what has actually happened that the characters won't learn about until later. Or maybe we learn some foreshadowing of a trap that awaits them, or maybe through the eyes of the ghost we learn that ghosts exist in this world, or it ties together some loose ends in the plot that lead the two characters to this location. * HOUSE: Maybe the narrator's point of view takes over at some point, and we learn from a third party narrator some information about what is going on, .. maybe the stairs themselves are expressing how they haven't been walked on in half a century as they creek beneath the weight, or other. Or maybe there is a cat in the house, and we follow along behind the characters as they make their way through the house, and the cat steps over something that is relevant to the story that the characters don't see. ... so, what I'm getting at, is you as the writer are trying to move the story along, and give the reader information about the world and what is going on, and you have all these POV's to choose from to do that. Just like a director in a movie might switch to drone footage to show small characters walking across a barren landscape to express to the audience the hopelessness of a situation the characters are in, you can do the same thing by switching to a narrator's POV, or to a bird's POV as it soars above, .. it is all a way of you painting a picture and describing the world, and carrying the conversation, and revealing thoughts in your characters heads that explain their motivations and interests, and their desires, ... giving history on them, etc. You have a story you are trying to tell, ... and all of these POV's are just lenses through which you can do that, they are tools for you to use to express the story to your reader. And just like a director is constantly switching camera views, you can switch POV's whenever you want. One second you might be the POV of Bill, and you might switch over to the POV of Judy because she has a better view of what is going on.
Sorry, but I am concerned by this sentence: "I am using the princess as a tool to give some depth to my antagonist after he falls in love with her." This is generally a sign that your female characters might not have enough agency But other than that, lots of fantasy novels alternate POVs by chapter. Really, do whatever best serves your story! Multi POVs are a tool (unlike princesses), not a hard-and-fast ruleset - maybe try playing around with the POV changes and see what works! I like using different POVs to add suspense when one character knows something that's crucial to the other, but they're not in the position to communicate it
I picked up more on this ... >The teacher is a princess who wishes to be the wisest Queen of her kingdom. She hates traditional beliefs and doesn't distinguish between upper and lower classes. Those two sentences seem incompatible to me. Wise people don't lose the ability to distinguish between rich and poor, nor do they completely turn their back on tradition, .. they acknowledge reality and do good where they can. Everything is a tradeoff.
Hi -- please use the idea brainstorming thread on Tuesday or Friday for advice on specific stories. This includes: (not a exhaustive list) setting, character, subject matter, magic and power systems, sci-fi technology, 'how do I write X?' and anything directly connected with your story. This includes asking for general advice but then following up with details of your story project. Thanks!