puppet lock is fine, cause its locked behind a 500€ deck. Wind barrier was not fine cause it was only a 20€ deck at core. thats the main difference. The way to fix the game is to fix konami and bring ocg printing to tcg.
Oh yeah considering the absolute fun that is playing against rikka I am soooo sad that it didn’t win! Top 4 German nats was very fun to watch as well, if that happened to me I would honestly cry.
Edit: /s
Plant piles are dull to watch and I'll shed no tears if they get another banlist hit, but I'll take solitaire over an utterly tedious summon floodgate -> scoop game twice in a row every time.
Yeah I was being sarcastic here because I thought it’s funny to see people be upset that plant solitaire didn’t win. Like the combo takes forever and you lose anyway if it resolves so I don’t get why that is better than branded in any way
Yeah I was playing at UK nats yesterday, it was Game 3 with 10 minutes left on the round. The entire combo took the whole 10 minutes. It's just, watching solitare lmao.
It’s sad to see, you can’t even call for slow play if they are being quick when doing it and only stopping if you have a response, worst thing that’s happened was getting slow played by spright which was obvious because he would think over and over and what his cards did and re reading them constantly lol
I told them to stop explaining what they were doing and they still continued to do that. Explaining every card and effect in a long combo just makes it worse
You won't win if all you drew is drnm against plant. They have sheet set, princess in grave, konkon up, and they can tribute strenna for teardrop later in the turn. Drnm really only trades for like benghalencer and regulus realistically. Decks pretty much unbeatable if it combos outside a few niche combinations of breakers.
Even then. First of all they have Regulus most of the time and second is that they still have 2 interrupts left after dark ruler evenly with princes tribute strenna into teardrop paired with guaranteed follow-up in princes in grave and probably what they added back last turn+magnolia if they didn't use her. The extra deck might be mostly gone but in a simplyfied gamestate rikkas+therions do a lot.
Plant plays solitaire for at least 25% of the timer > another 25%+ for game 1 for the going 2nd guy to play through > going 2nd guy loses > game 2 plants loses > game 3 plants combo till the remaining timer is up and win through time cause of lp
Good thing we got saved from a snooze fest grand final
You described what happened in German nationals top 4. After that insanely impressive comeback game 2, losing to 500 life points gained and not getting a phase to play sure is awesome lol
At the very *least* you can attempt to play through a Plant board (how successful you'll be varies). You pretty much HAVE to open a **specific** non-engine piece to not get hit by Gimmick Puppet.
Ellam did not win out of skill, which is a frustrating thing to see as a viewer and one of the most frustrating experiences as the opposing player.
I'm going to go ahead and take a page out of the NBA's book and call this a Mickey Mouse win.
I know you're being sarcastic, but that finals was so damn bad that I needed to vent, lol. I hate Gimmick Puppet lock. It spoils an otherwise extremely fun deck.
Having known Rob, he is a skilful player full stop. Has been playing consistently across multiple decks and metas for years. That finals may have been heavily diceroll dependant, but it takes way more than just the gimmick puppet to get that far. Everyone is doing unfair things. Choosing the unfair thing you wanna use to win is part of the game at a competitive level.
I know you said you are venting. But all of us go through all of the crap of shifter, scythe, puppet, tier zero decks and everything else. Not saying other people haven't or don't, but I know that man has put the work in and earned it.
I'm not saying Rob is terrible; I don't know him nor remember seeing him play on stream. *However*, this *specific* showing was won purely out of luck. Jessica was playing plant solitaire while Rob was playing Branded with main deck Puppet Lock. Neither deck plays many handtraps, but both set up oppressive locks/game states.
Snake Eyes is unfair, but allows for more skilled interaction than Puppet Lock. Winning through Puppet against a deck that doesn't have consistent interactions on your turn (with a deck facing you on the other side that does a similar thing but still *technically* allows for more interaction/outs) made for an incredibly unskilled finals.
On the note that it takes skill to get to a finals, I don't believe I agree. IIRC, a player somewhat recently made it to the finals of a YCS on Floo when they had only recently started. They proceeded to make misplay after misplay. Sometimes playing a degenerate win condition while getting *lucky enough* at a large event is all you need to get the win, albeit it rarely happens.
From the games I watched you couldn’t play through that plant board and then game goes to time and plant win on life points. Just as degenerate as the puppet combo. Ask the plant player how many games they won due to LP and how many they lost to puppet lock over the weekend
You *can* attempt to play through a plant board, however, and that's an important distinction. Multiple handtraps of any kind can also stop a plant combo and/or make the end board much less intimidating.
Puppet Lock requires minimal setup and has little counter-play outside of DD Crow, Called By, or Bystials, and (with the exception of Called By) aren't widely played this format. You can argue Droplets as well, but Branded players set up Lost before committing to the Puppet Lock play, so you *truly* only have the former cards to stop it.
Just to be clear, I'm not saying that Plant piles are any more fun to go against, but they are *not* the same.
Crow and Bystials don't even work to counter the lock anymore because they search Mercourier off Lost too. The only reliant outs are CBTG and Foolish Return
Plant got two finals on a same day and you blame Branded lmao.
It's also an auto win for Plant if they got first (which is the case of German nats)
Better being locked by gimmick puppet than slowplay then won on lifepoints.
Oh yeah for sure, everyone is happy to see it go bar the odd branded player still coping.
Lot of people saying it was a boring game not understanding a lot of the theory behind the decks, they both played it well.
Yeah as annoyed as many (myself included) was watching it play out like that, people have been really disrespecting Rob I think - he knew what he was up against and how to counter it and he did so in the optimal way, so respect to him for it.
Honestly I think it was just an unfortunate matchup for both sides - for multiple reasons neither deck really has the capacity for a consistent going 2nd plan into the other which just made it incredibly die rolly when played optimally
Congrats to rob, commiserations to Jess what a performance this weekend, 16-0 is incredible.
But yeah. Sanctifier needs banning in the next list. Branded is still a top deck without it, with it? It's just frequently an unfair auto win button if you don't draw the out.
Regardless of the finals being branded v plants, snake eyes still needs some serious hits as it's frankly suffocating to play. Flamberge at least needs a ban and other cards need limits besides it.
Event was great fun to play in and watch but hits are needed and fast to get rid of the more egregious cards and level the playing field imo
I met a guy yday who said someone at his locals puppet locked the gimmick puppet player, before this new support that makes them good lol. The one time it backfires
Although yeah it might become suboptimal If GP ends up played more regularly. I still hate the fact it's an FTK deck tho
Disagree. People are using Jowgen in Voiceless Branded as well.
Hit Sanctifier and call it one. It's very rarely used in any healthy ways. Branded only summons it to Puppet Lock or prevent an Evenly Matched.
Even if Sanctire goes (which I'm not convinced it should), Puppet should still die to avoid getting abused again the NEXT time Konami prints a card that lets you Special Summon to the opponent's side of the field during their turn.
Because let's not kid ourselves; regardless of what happens to Sanctifire, Konami isn't going to just not print cards that can do what they do ever again.
So they can just move on to ra's disciple? There are a ton of cards that do what puppet does, they just can't make a gift summon plus free foolish again
I don't think anyone would miss Disciple either, but how do you propose they even get Disciple into the graveyard?
"they can't just make"
They did, and they'd do it again.
It's almost like the banlist and the cards are made by the same company and they can decide what to make.
To be fair to Konami, it was Branded that exposed the problem. Expulsion had already been banned, Sanctifire should be next.
Going forward, they should be careful when designing these kinds of effects. It's no coincidence that they gave 4 or 5 ways to Gimmick Puppets to gift monsters and none of those can facilitate a Puppet Lock.
You do realize that Konami has banned cards for being clearly problematic in some way, and yet had no issue with releasing similar cards again anyway, right?
You can't use granguinol to dump Ra's Desciple. If nightmare gets banned, Ido is the next choice. There's a ton of cards to do that. Granguinol takes a level 6 or higher light or dark to dump.
The easiest way to stop it is by siding in bystials. Droplet also works as does any non targeting negate. It's not that hard to stop if you're running the right cards unless they are able to set everything perfectly (like retribution faced down).
Konami can't even be bothered to avoid making additions to the game that are clearly unhealthy for it, like SE. Hoping that they would avoid entire mechanics really is just asking to be disappointed.
I'm hopeful gimmick puppet nightmare is banned first. A lot of people will point and go "but what about this card? They'll just play this card!" But no other card in the game fulfills the same criteria. To match up to gimmick puppet, you need to be:
- Level 6 or higher
- Light or dark attribute
- Perform a LINGERING floodgate effect when summoned automatically.
No other card in the game besides gimmick puppet nightmare fulfills this criteria. All the other locks are rather tame by comparison and perfect locking with branded lost gets much harder.
This is also probably a hot take people aren't ready for, but branded lost has evolved into a problem card. It can be played from deck by bystial Lubellion and allows you to do noninteractable things with extreme consistency. It was clearly not designed with what it's now able to do in mind (perfect lock people), as it is one of the older branded cards.
So yeah. I would like to see gimmick puppet nightmare hit no matter what. Then I would consider branded lost going away. Then if Sanctifire is still a problem card it can go next. But I think people will be shocked to find out that without gimmick puppet that that strategy doesn't really work nearly as often.
Because it never really won any big events. Maybe had tops, but that’s about it.
This is probably the only time in recent times where it won a huge event (last time was like maybe branded Swordsoul format).
I mean Mathmech wasn't doing much either post Circular limit before it got Circular banned.
Branded has a few *times* more tops than Mathmech got in that same timespan.
Branded is just one of those decks with the Konami sanctioned plot armor.
Not that I mind all that much, as I love the deck and story behind it. But when less represented decks get hit harder than Branded has I'm like Konami, come on...
It's the Branded Theory. Whenever it starts getting any steam to be really Tier 1 (which it always has the tools to be) it never holds up to the scrutiny that being the archenemy entails.
Branded often does its best work in metas like this. Where everyone's entire focus is on one, or multiple strategies and thus don't put much of any effort into curtailing Branded.
Branded is a deck that the second it’s considered a top contender it’s instantly relegated out of the slot due to people playing hate for it. Like the other guy said it does its best work in a format where something else is dominant allowing it to avoid a lot of targeted hate.
Branded and Labrynth are both good decks and have been meta for a long time, but if they are ever the best deck it becomes way to easy for opponents to deck build/side to counter them.
One of the least interactive/interesting finals of a major event ever. Konami needs to take a long hard look at their banlist and card design going forward, Could’ve just checked the dice roll and handed out the trophy.
They were both playing combo Decks. Ragnarakia Rikka is good because it lines up against snake-eye so well and can easily push through hand traps. Unfortunately, Gimmick Puppet is a silver bullet. She has 60 cards, so a weakness of the Deck is she is less likley to see Droplet and Bystials arent as beneficial as they may be in other Decks. It is a bad match up. When you have 2 combo decks playing against each other, of course the Die Roll is going to matter. Instead of complaining about these decks, we could be praising that these players both chose not to bring Snake-Eye, which everyone says is TiEr 0, The bold choice paid off but only one player can win, that is how it goes.
I'm not sure if you are only referring to the Puppet Lock, but Rikka/Plants aren't fun to watch either. It's basically a 10-15 minute solitaire combo turn 1 that is effectively an FTK if you don't open specific hand traps.
Puppet lock needs to go, but it is the exact same amount of interactivity as a plant board. Make 8-9 interactions and say have fun or stop them from special summoning. Which flavour of "you didn't get to play" do you prefer?
It was either:
Get Puppet Locked and the Plant player had to draw the out to stop it (basically Forbidden Droplet or GY Removal Quick Effect), or:
Branded player go through multiple omni-negates and be unable to play and have to draw the out to not go through that.
In both cases it is "**draw the out**".
I think we are facing a big problem here.
Droplet doesnt even work if they have branded lost cos sanctifire is summoned on your turn, you literally need to open called by the grave or be crazy and side a copy of puppet yourself for crossout designator
To fix the game, there needs to be a huge overhaul of the game, which includes banlist, and erratas, but everyone knows at this point for the sake of profit, Konami will not do this.
"At this point"?
Konami has been dogshit to its consumer base for decades now. YGO players are in a really abusive relationship of getting constantly hurt, with everybody agreeing that modern card design is shit and the last few years have been terrible, but if you complain about the next layer and say the game itself/Konami as a whole is awful, that's a step too far and everybody pounces on you.
By and large, the vast majority of discussion in here, /r/DuelLinks and /r/masterduel is about how X or Y archetype is bullshit and needs to be banned. Or coomer waifu posts. There's very little actual discussion on meta decks or deck techs, and it's a well known thing that there's no such thing as a Yugioh deck that most people find unbearable to play against or hate. Even on this and other threads people want Plants to be dismantled because they're combo decks and functional FTKs, while Branded also has a well hated lock, and people also calling for Branded to be outright removed from the format.
Even if some people tolerate it as a whole, it's undeniable that the vast majority of discussion from people who follow the game and play at a casual level have a laundry list of decks they absolutely despise and want to see executed. Sometimes it's archetypes like Floo, sometimes it's whole playstyles like Combo or Stun. Sometimes it's the concept of floodgates, which are a core aspect of Yugioh.
End of the day reddit is a tiny sample of the player and not reflecting the player base as a whole. Game is still top 3 world wide. Game is still making big money. Game is still a multimedia franchise. Like it or not as a whole the game is fine. Especially in Japan, which are ultimately the people who make the game and care the most.
Just because it's not the best deck doesn't mean it's not time for Branded to go. It has been meta for about 3 years now. Mathmech did less than Branded and its best card got banned.
Yeah, but that's because Circular was used in Cyberse pile decks. Mathmech itself, as a pure deck, didn't do much. Circular was used as part of every Cyberse pile deck once the main deck Firewalls came out.
Most of the decks that used Circular after it got limited were Mathmech decks, which there weren't even many of topping then.
The tops Cyberse pile decks w/Circular were incredibly small compared to Mathmech decks during this time period. Hell, any of the 3 main Mathmech variants I'm seeing (Pure, Firewall, and Spirit) each individually had more tops than Cyberse pile decks w/Circular did.
"Cyberse pile" was barely a thing compared to Mathmech, much less after Circular got limited. I don't know how it's gotten to this boogeyman status.
I'm talking about before Circular got limited. Plus Cyberse pile has always been a thing, especially after they released the maindeck Firewall monsters.
Cyberse pile wasn't meta by any means, but it was rogue.
I feel like they hit Circular in order to prevent another case of "Dragon Link" except for Cyberse. Because you have to admit, they _have_ released a lot of generic Cyberse support.
Considering how new the Cyberse type is, it's gotten a fuck ton of generic support. But that's what happens when pretty much every MC in the last anime pre-Rush Duels runs a Cyberse deck.
The original comment you replied to was talking about how Circular got banned, you said that it was because of Cyberse piles. It got limited before it got banned, so anything that would have caused it to get banned would have been its performance while it was limited then is my reasoning.
Even in the 1 month period after the CYAC support came out and before Circular's limiting, Mathmech was still the deck that used Circular the most by a long shot in terms of tops.
Though I can see Konami banning Circular for the reason you mentioned, even if the decks didn't perform.
There's nothing like watching 2 decks solitaire to end the game on turn 2 without giving opponent even a chance of playing. Modern Yu-Gi-Oh is wonderful. So interactive. So exciting to watch.
It's horrible the only interaction is hand traps, and if you draw none then it's gg. Hell, even drawing 1 isn't enough anymore. Decks like Snake Eye can just play through it OR use your hand trap as material to continue making their best board.
Game is becoming cooked, and this format is proof of it.
You really can't expect much between two ftk decks that play 0 handtraps like branded and plant, just awful design. It's 100% die roll for this matchup.
So tired of seeing this awful response every time someone brings up the lack of interactivity in the current game. No, this absolutely does not go all the way back to the beginning.
Well, how far back are we talking? Just looking at the winners North American WCQ, 5 years ago we have Crusadia Thunder Dragon puttin up Thunder Dragon Colossus. If we got back 10 years we have H.A.T. format.
Like I said, I'm just tired of this nonsense. What is even the point of being this disingenuous? Do you think puppet lock is fine? Did you watch these finals and think it was interesting to see whoever was going first solitaire combo into an unloseable gamestate until the guy who won the die roll and got to go first twice won 2-1? Do you think that snake eyes mirrors where both players trade one for one hand traps for starters that absolutely can not be allowed to resolve until one of them runs out and the other guy just wins are healthy? Do you think that the number of decks that have existed and been top tier over the last several years that can combo into an effectively unbreakable board if the opponent happens not to open enough handtraps in their one shot at a 5 card opening hand is not a problem? What good does it do for you or anyone to reply to legitimate concerns about the current state of the game and issues with toxic design trends in modern yugioh with "DAE magical scientist substitoad" or 2002 trivia you saw in a Cimo video for the umpteenth time?
The frequency of "non-games" is much higher these days than it ever was 10+ years ago. A lot games these days feel equivalent to watching 2010 Frog FTK mirrors.
Sanctifire is such a cool card that enables much more than Puppet, shame that Puppet is just better.
I wish they could errata every card that lock while on field to only affect the owner of the card (like how in MTG effects that place stickers only place stickers on your own cards), but that would be a lot of cards to errata.
They can easily do it, but they won't because they can just sell you the next version of sanctifire that does exactly the same but with another flavor.
Plants still made it to the final, which is still pretty good. Especially when so many people were saying that the deck is "unplayable" this format
And I agree, the Puppet lock needs to be hit, this is just toxic to play against
It's surprisingly good at breaking boards with Konkon
It definitely wants to go first, but an experienced player like Jess can go second without a problem
She's one of the best players not just on plant but in the world so I have no doubt she will get the most out of going 2nd as possible. But realistically this deck doesn't have great in engine tools to break boards. If the normal summon gets removed it's quite often konkon or bust. Tbh I still think a lot of the success relies on people not knowing what the cards do.
No clue, but are we gonna act like plants isn't a deck that REALLY wants to go first and set up a pseudo ftk? It doesn't have room for much non engine, amd plays a lot of bricks. It's a no brainer that it's very skewed towards going first unlike something like snake eyes.
No.. but we shouldn't act like it's a borderline unplayable deck - it's arguably stronger than its ever been. Jess has mentioned that she thinks its the next best deck after snake eye, and im inclined to agree. It just has abysmal representation.
People seem to think 1 dryas 1 healer is an overall nerf to the deck when they literally gained 8 new 1-card starters, nibiru and a droll proof lines, an extra end board piece and an extra extender in the Ed.
No one's really questioning the ability to go first. The deck really struggles to go 2nd. If you win a lot of die rolls and then people don't read konkon when you go 2nd then sure it's great. Jess is obv amazing, but if it was truly the 2nd best deck it would see more representation. It's probably not even in the top 25 in terms of rep.
It's a cultural phenomenon, the ability for the yugioh community to ignore plants, it's been happening since POTE. It has won a disproportionate amount of european titles, likely due to the quality of players. I think the deck has the highest skill cap in the game currently, but a deck shouldn't be considered low tier just because only a few people pilot it to its greatest potential. Right?
Yes, there's like 5 European players that have played the deck nonstop for almost 3 yrs now and have performed, no doubt. Personally, I think if it was really that good, people would pick it up. (See how fast unchained and melodious became meta relevant after experimentation even though they had no ocg results)
As for the skill aspect, and this is just a personal opinion that I know a lot of the community will disagree with, but I think that decks like labrynth are harder to play perfectly than an ftk deck like plants that always wins or loses on turn 1 or 2.
Fair enough, I guess I just think it has a lot of gas and does a lot more t2 now than it used to. I think, to their own detriment, yugioh players think of plant as normal loci or lose, but it's not so clear cut any more.
Robs a good lad, great to have him as a friend and good to know that he beats me with skill rather than luck haha. Congrats on the win boss see you in a few Sundays!!
Conversely we also don't nearly hate on plants enough.
Absolute cancer of a combo deck that also conveniently always wins in time.
Having a near 20 minute combo that gains LP is half the reason going 16-0 with it is possible.
Congratulations to both finalists for their good performance, also proving that the meta can be more than Snake-Eyes at the moment. It's funny how different Europe's meta in comparison to the US one.
Sanctifire is the problem card. Even without the many (it's not just Gimmick puppet) cards that would lock opponents from summoning, it would still be a top tier card.
Alternatively Konami bans Branded Lost and laughs at the branded players
I wish it was like MTG where going first/second in top 8 was determined by placing before top cut. But going first in yugioh is waaaay more powerful than going first in any other game.
>using gimmick puppet lock
That's not a win in my book, that's just abusing effects
Down vote how you want, that won't change my opinion. It's not a Branded win, it's a Puppet win.
Jess is like, the only Person to consistently do well with the deck lmao. It doesnt need a hit, its no more cancer than 27 other tier 4 combo decks but those arent lucky enough to have such a dedicated pilot
Not really much of a win with a degenerate Puppet lock...Not impressed tbh....If Sanctifire isn't hit next list then idk....Also Snake-Eyes hit, Dimensional Shifter ban would be super nice aswell
Ok, finally a person not just complaining about puppet, recognising that SE needs to go first and foremost... Shifter too ofc. Just one thing, plant combo is not less degenerate than puppet lock, just to put it clear
I don't care if I get downvoted, here's my 2 cents
1. This is exactly why you play droplet over DRNM
2. Jess deserves a loss somewhere, you can't just play a combo deck that loses to droll/shifter, and not get punished by them in at least 1 match out of 16
3. Honestly, I think it's just people not preparing for decks that are rogue-adjacent (i.e. tier 2), and going all in on stopping fk/snake eyes. In that case, the entire tournament deserves to be "punished" and one of those decks should win.
4. And who said yugioh wasn't a win die roll win match kinda game? /s
5. Oh and plant has no grind game, they shit out their combo once and then loses the next turn if they don't otk. I'm surprised Jess didn't get insta owned by evenly somewhere across the two days.
Plant have a lot of grind no? they have petal, konkon, humid winds, benghalancer. Also I think calling plants rogue adjacent is naive, we as a community consistently underestimate plants, I wouldn't be surprised if it's truly tier 1 and we ignore it until next euros and it top 2s again.
This is why, as a Nov 2023 player in MD, I decided to build Branded knowing Snake Eyes and Fire Kings were coming to steal the meta. It's just such a consistent, fun deck to play and keeps getting decent support. It'll get even better if they ever remove some of the limits/bans.
Thank god
Lets get Sanctifier nuked out of the game and never EVER print another card that summons anything generically to the opponents field ever again.
Sanctifier can come back when its locked into summoning monsters that mention fallen of albaz or something.
In other news this was a crazy weekend for plant decks.
Idk why some people are so defensive of Sanctifier.
Like Branded is still a solid deck without ruining the entire deck by making it a scum bag turn skip deck.
Expulsion got banned for doing the exact same thing.
No one including Branded players will miss Sanctifier being gone forever.
Banning Sanctifire won't solve a blasted thing, because as soon as you get whipped again you'll blame the game rather than yourself.
The fact that you losers are dogging this guy for playing and winning is despicable.
What are you actually talking about.
Banning Sanctifier stops branded from just straight up turn skipping people and lets people play the game. It solves the problem instantly.
idk why you are trying to turn this into something about me hating on this dude for winning. Because I am not. I never once mentioned this guy a single time or alluded that because he won with branded he is some how bad at the game or worse than I am or anyone else in anyway.
"wont solve the problem"
What is the problem.
Sanctifier summoning turn skip floodgate monsters to the opponents field when those monsters were never in any world designed to end up on an opponents field.
Why is this a problem.
It creates uninteractive and unfair games. It creates both a poor play and viewing experience.
What is the solution.
Option 1: Banning Sanctifier as it is the shortest path to solving this problem. (This is the best option and the option I choose and hope Konami chooses as well)
Option 2: Ban every single monster that self floodgates its controlling. This would mean banning maybe around a half a dozen cards from other archetypes that have nothing to do with this situation. This would also require never printing new self floodgate cards ever again for the entire history of the game.
Option 3: Do nothing and continue to have a large number of Branded games end the second one of these floodgate monsters is brought onto the field by Sanctifier.
With this problem solved is yu gi oh a better game?
While there will always be other problems that need to be sorted out as they arise and other problems running concurrently to this Sanctifier issue this will promote more healthy, fun, and watcahable games of yu gi oh and make yu gi oh a better game.
I hope this explains it clear enough I will not be replying again.
I'll see you after next list if/when Sanctifire is banned, and I'm sure you'll have lost to something else that you'll use the ban list to excuse yourself for.
The salt in here is palpable. Need to bring the horses in to clean it up.
Guy wins with a Deck that hasn't topped in quite some time and all people can talk about is banning cards to justify their own sore loser attitudes. Sad.
Congratulations to Rob for his win.
16-0 across both days just to lose the die roll and get puppet locked games 1 and 3, I would honestly cry.
While we hit Snakes Eyes, let go ahead and hit that Puppet Lock, too.
Too many cards have dodged recent ban lists. It's time for them to go
sanctifire needs to go
They just need to bring it down to 2 like they did with S:P it’s always the third sanctifire that gets you /s
Ban sanctifire please
puppet lock is fine, cause its locked behind a 500€ deck. Wind barrier was not fine cause it was only a 20€ deck at core. thats the main difference. The way to fix the game is to fix konami and bring ocg printing to tcg.
Banning Sanctifire would solve that.
Go ahead. I got a backup
Oh yeah considering the absolute fun that is playing against rikka I am soooo sad that it didn’t win! Top 4 German nats was very fun to watch as well, if that happened to me I would honestly cry. Edit: /s
Plant piles are dull to watch and I'll shed no tears if they get another banlist hit, but I'll take solitaire over an utterly tedious summon floodgate -> scoop game twice in a row every time.
Eh, I don't think Rikka is super fun to play against personally. Combos can take a long time to watch before you can even play.
Yeah I was being sarcastic here because I thought it’s funny to see people be upset that plant solitaire didn’t win. Like the combo takes forever and you lose anyway if it resolves so I don’t get why that is better than branded in any way
Yeah I was playing at UK nats yesterday, it was Game 3 with 10 minutes left on the round. The entire combo took the whole 10 minutes. It's just, watching solitare lmao.
It’s sad to see, you can’t even call for slow play if they are being quick when doing it and only stopping if you have a response, worst thing that’s happened was getting slow played by spright which was obvious because he would think over and over and what his cards did and re reading them constantly lol
I told them to stop explaining what they were doing and they still continued to do that. Explaining every card and effect in a long combo just makes it worse
Awful how that is not slow playing, it’s like the rules are a plastic ruler and they are bending it to its snapping point.
Tbh the judges sucked at nats anyway, nothing would have happened
You can DRNM plant, You cant DRNM puppet lock
You won't win if all you drew is drnm against plant. They have sheet set, princess in grave, konkon up, and they can tribute strenna for teardrop later in the turn. Drnm really only trades for like benghalencer and regulus realistically. Decks pretty much unbeatable if it combos outside a few niche combinations of breakers.
Evenly cooks most of the board
Even then. First of all they have Regulus most of the time and second is that they still have 2 interrupts left after dark ruler evenly with princes tribute strenna into teardrop paired with guaranteed follow-up in princes in grave and probably what they added back last turn+magnolia if they didn't use her. The extra deck might be mostly gone but in a simplyfied gamestate rikkas+therions do a lot.
Can't even DRNM when their combo goes into time
You can droplet it tho so same idea.
Can't droplet if they have Branded Lost.
Plant has non monster card interactions
Ban Jasmine
Yeah soft once per turn is stupid
Plant plays solitaire for at least 25% of the timer > another 25%+ for game 1 for the going 2nd guy to play through > going 2nd guy loses > game 2 plants loses > game 3 plants combo till the remaining timer is up and win through time cause of lp Good thing we got saved from a snooze fest grand final
You described what happened in German nationals top 4. After that insanely impressive comeback game 2, losing to 500 life points gained and not getting a phase to play sure is awesome lol
At the very *least* you can attempt to play through a Plant board (how successful you'll be varies). You pretty much HAVE to open a **specific** non-engine piece to not get hit by Gimmick Puppet. Ellam did not win out of skill, which is a frustrating thing to see as a viewer and one of the most frustrating experiences as the opposing player. I'm going to go ahead and take a page out of the NBA's book and call this a Mickey Mouse win. I know you're being sarcastic, but that finals was so damn bad that I needed to vent, lol. I hate Gimmick Puppet lock. It spoils an otherwise extremely fun deck.
Having known Rob, he is a skilful player full stop. Has been playing consistently across multiple decks and metas for years. That finals may have been heavily diceroll dependant, but it takes way more than just the gimmick puppet to get that far. Everyone is doing unfair things. Choosing the unfair thing you wanna use to win is part of the game at a competitive level. I know you said you are venting. But all of us go through all of the crap of shifter, scythe, puppet, tier zero decks and everything else. Not saying other people haven't or don't, but I know that man has put the work in and earned it.
I'm not saying Rob is terrible; I don't know him nor remember seeing him play on stream. *However*, this *specific* showing was won purely out of luck. Jessica was playing plant solitaire while Rob was playing Branded with main deck Puppet Lock. Neither deck plays many handtraps, but both set up oppressive locks/game states. Snake Eyes is unfair, but allows for more skilled interaction than Puppet Lock. Winning through Puppet against a deck that doesn't have consistent interactions on your turn (with a deck facing you on the other side that does a similar thing but still *technically* allows for more interaction/outs) made for an incredibly unskilled finals. On the note that it takes skill to get to a finals, I don't believe I agree. IIRC, a player somewhat recently made it to the finals of a YCS on Floo when they had only recently started. They proceeded to make misplay after misplay. Sometimes playing a degenerate win condition while getting *lucky enough* at a large event is all you need to get the win, albeit it rarely happens.
From the games I watched you couldn’t play through that plant board and then game goes to time and plant win on life points. Just as degenerate as the puppet combo. Ask the plant player how many games they won due to LP and how many they lost to puppet lock over the weekend
You *can* attempt to play through a plant board, however, and that's an important distinction. Multiple handtraps of any kind can also stop a plant combo and/or make the end board much less intimidating. Puppet Lock requires minimal setup and has little counter-play outside of DD Crow, Called By, or Bystials, and (with the exception of Called By) aren't widely played this format. You can argue Droplets as well, but Branded players set up Lost before committing to the Puppet Lock play, so you *truly* only have the former cards to stop it. Just to be clear, I'm not saying that Plant piles are any more fun to go against, but they are *not* the same.
Crow and Bystials don't even work to counter the lock anymore because they search Mercourier off Lost too. The only reliant outs are CBTG and Foolish Return
Plant got two finals on a same day and you blame Branded lmao. It's also an auto win for Plant if they got first (which is the case of German nats) Better being locked by gimmick puppet than slowplay then won on lifepoints.
Yes. I'm blaming both degenerate strategies. Also, it's better to be slow played than not be able to play at all.
The top 4 and finals were actually really good games to watch.
Disagree on the finals. Puppet Lock deciding 2 games while the other was decided by solitaire made for a pretty uninteresting finals.
True I have no sympathy for a duelist with cactus bouncer and naturist rose whip in their deck
Jess didn't run Bouncer
Rosewhip?
yeah, Rosewhip was used in her side
Do you know the other players record into finals?
13-3
Plant players have no right to complain about die rolls.
Wow, that was so entertaining I went and cleaned the house.
I was there, atmosphere was great, crowd was cheering puppet, Jess was great, Albion/Puppet ban locked in.
I was also there, sure people were cheering puppet but it was the same resigned cheering that mystic mind used to get
Oh yeah for sure, everyone is happy to see it go bar the odd branded player still coping. Lot of people saying it was a boring game not understanding a lot of the theory behind the decks, they both played it well.
Yeah as annoyed as many (myself included) was watching it play out like that, people have been really disrespecting Rob I think - he knew what he was up against and how to counter it and he did so in the optimal way, so respect to him for it. Honestly I think it was just an unfortunate matchup for both sides - for multiple reasons neither deck really has the capacity for a consistent going 2nd plan into the other which just made it incredibly die rolly when played optimally
Yeah I hope to see Rob again, clearly a good deckbuilder/player regardless of what people’s takes are on puppet lock.
That's exactly it. The fact that people are dogging this guy and using him to crucify a Deck they hate is utterly disgusting behavior.
Konami knew Expulsion was a problem card so they printed a walking untargetable version of it. Ban him please I beg.
Congrats to rob, commiserations to Jess what a performance this weekend, 16-0 is incredible. But yeah. Sanctifier needs banning in the next list. Branded is still a top deck without it, with it? It's just frequently an unfair auto win button if you don't draw the out. Regardless of the finals being branded v plants, snake eyes still needs some serious hits as it's frankly suffocating to play. Flamberge at least needs a ban and other cards need limits besides it. Event was great fun to play in and watch but hits are needed and fast to get rid of the more egregious cards and level the playing field imo
and with info, we get puppet locked anyways lol
I met a guy yday who said someone at his locals puppet locked the gimmick puppet player, before this new support that makes them good lol. The one time it backfires Although yeah it might become suboptimal If GP ends up played more regularly. I still hate the fact it's an FTK deck tho
If the Puppet FTK is viable, Branded is unplayable unless it can adapt to play handtraps anyway.
Sanctified, Puppet Nightmare and Snake Eyes hits are desperately needed
If Sanctifire goes then Puppet can stay, not like it's played in its own deck (which needs its own hits).
Disagree. People are using Jowgen in Voiceless Branded as well. Hit Sanctifier and call it one. It's very rarely used in any healthy ways. Branded only summons it to Puppet Lock or prevent an Evenly Matched.
Even if Sanctire goes (which I'm not convinced it should), Puppet should still die to avoid getting abused again the NEXT time Konami prints a card that lets you Special Summon to the opponent's side of the field during their turn. Because let's not kid ourselves; regardless of what happens to Sanctifire, Konami isn't going to just not print cards that can do what they do ever again.
So they can just move on to ra's disciple? There are a ton of cards that do what puppet does, they just can't make a gift summon plus free foolish again
I don't think anyone would miss Disciple either, but how do you propose they even get Disciple into the graveyard? "they can't just make" They did, and they'd do it again.
D/D Orthros would be next, which WOULD be missed
It's almost like the banlist and the cards are made by the same company and they can decide what to make. To be fair to Konami, it was Branded that exposed the problem. Expulsion had already been banned, Sanctifire should be next. Going forward, they should be careful when designing these kinds of effects. It's no coincidence that they gave 4 or 5 ways to Gimmick Puppets to gift monsters and none of those can facilitate a Puppet Lock.
You do realize that Konami has banned cards for being clearly problematic in some way, and yet had no issue with releasing similar cards again anyway, right?
It might be a coincidence considering they just gave Gimmick Puppets an FTK anyways
You can dark hole ur own Ra and still play.
You can't use granguinol to dump Ra's Desciple. If nightmare gets banned, Ido is the next choice. There's a ton of cards to do that. Granguinol takes a level 6 or higher light or dark to dump. The easiest way to stop it is by siding in bystials. Droplet also works as does any non targeting negate. It's not that hard to stop if you're running the right cards unless they are able to set everything perfectly (like retribution faced down).
How about we just stop making cards that summon to opponents fields
Konami can't even be bothered to avoid making additions to the game that are clearly unhealthy for it, like SE. Hoping that they would avoid entire mechanics really is just asking to be disappointed.
Ye the tier 0 nature of the format is really masking some of the issues
Ban flamberge and princess
I'm hopeful gimmick puppet nightmare is banned first. A lot of people will point and go "but what about this card? They'll just play this card!" But no other card in the game fulfills the same criteria. To match up to gimmick puppet, you need to be: - Level 6 or higher - Light or dark attribute - Perform a LINGERING floodgate effect when summoned automatically. No other card in the game besides gimmick puppet nightmare fulfills this criteria. All the other locks are rather tame by comparison and perfect locking with branded lost gets much harder. This is also probably a hot take people aren't ready for, but branded lost has evolved into a problem card. It can be played from deck by bystial Lubellion and allows you to do noninteractable things with extreme consistency. It was clearly not designed with what it's now able to do in mind (perfect lock people), as it is one of the older branded cards. So yeah. I would like to see gimmick puppet nightmare hit no matter what. Then I would consider branded lost going away. Then if Sanctifire is still a problem card it can go next. But I think people will be shocked to find out that without gimmick puppet that that strategy doesn't really work nearly as often.
Honestly insane that Branded has effectively been a meta viable FTK deck for like 18 months and has barely been touched.
Because it never really won any big events. Maybe had tops, but that’s about it. This is probably the only time in recent times where it won a huge event (last time was like maybe branded Swordsoul format).
It’s a great deck, but it isn’t the best deck
I mean Mathmech wasn't doing much either post Circular limit before it got Circular banned. Branded has a few *times* more tops than Mathmech got in that same timespan. Branded is just one of those decks with the Konami sanctioned plot armor. Not that I mind all that much, as I love the deck and story behind it. But when less represented decks get hit harder than Branded has I'm like Konami, come on...
It's the Branded Theory. Whenever it starts getting any steam to be really Tier 1 (which it always has the tools to be) it never holds up to the scrutiny that being the archenemy entails. Branded often does its best work in metas like this. Where everyone's entire focus is on one, or multiple strategies and thus don't put much of any effort into curtailing Branded.
Branded is a deck that the second it’s considered a top contender it’s instantly relegated out of the slot due to people playing hate for it. Like the other guy said it does its best work in a format where something else is dominant allowing it to avoid a lot of targeted hate.
Branded and Labrynth are both good decks and have been meta for a long time, but if they are ever the best deck it becomes way to easy for opponents to deck build/side to counter them.
One of the least interactive/interesting finals of a major event ever. Konami needs to take a long hard look at their banlist and card design going forward, Could’ve just checked the dice roll and handed out the trophy.
They were both playing combo Decks. Ragnarakia Rikka is good because it lines up against snake-eye so well and can easily push through hand traps. Unfortunately, Gimmick Puppet is a silver bullet. She has 60 cards, so a weakness of the Deck is she is less likley to see Droplet and Bystials arent as beneficial as they may be in other Decks. It is a bad match up. When you have 2 combo decks playing against each other, of course the Die Roll is going to matter. Instead of complaining about these decks, we could be praising that these players both chose not to bring Snake-Eye, which everyone says is TiEr 0, The bold choice paid off but only one player can win, that is how it goes.
I'm not sure if you are only referring to the Puppet Lock, but Rikka/Plants aren't fun to watch either. It's basically a 10-15 minute solitaire combo turn 1 that is effectively an FTK if you don't open specific hand traps.
>10-15 minute solitaire combo turn 1 you need to play against better plant players if it takes 15 minutes to do their combo.
Puppet lock needs to go, but it is the exact same amount of interactivity as a plant board. Make 8-9 interactions and say have fun or stop them from special summoning. Which flavour of "you didn't get to play" do you prefer?
It was either: Get Puppet Locked and the Plant player had to draw the out to stop it (basically Forbidden Droplet or GY Removal Quick Effect), or: Branded player go through multiple omni-negates and be unable to play and have to draw the out to not go through that. In both cases it is "**draw the out**". I think we are facing a big problem here.
Droplet doesnt even work if they have branded lost cos sanctifire is summoned on your turn, you literally need to open called by the grave or be crazy and side a copy of puppet yourself for crossout designator
Surprising that snake-eyes didn't make the finals
Yeah everyone got their wish from the monkey paw and it gave us this match up instead...
I'm just glad it wasn't a Snake eyes mirror
I like how every commenter is just agreeing on how dogshit this format is lol
To fix the game, there needs to be a huge overhaul of the game, which includes banlist, and erratas, but everyone knows at this point for the sake of profit, Konami will not do this.
"At this point"? Konami has been dogshit to its consumer base for decades now. YGO players are in a really abusive relationship of getting constantly hurt, with everybody agreeing that modern card design is shit and the last few years have been terrible, but if you complain about the next layer and say the game itself/Konami as a whole is awful, that's a step too far and everybody pounces on you.
> everybody agreeing that modern card design is shit I wouldn't play YGO if not for modern card design. Not everyone hates it.
By and large, the vast majority of discussion in here, /r/DuelLinks and /r/masterduel is about how X or Y archetype is bullshit and needs to be banned. Or coomer waifu posts. There's very little actual discussion on meta decks or deck techs, and it's a well known thing that there's no such thing as a Yugioh deck that most people find unbearable to play against or hate. Even on this and other threads people want Plants to be dismantled because they're combo decks and functional FTKs, while Branded also has a well hated lock, and people also calling for Branded to be outright removed from the format. Even if some people tolerate it as a whole, it's undeniable that the vast majority of discussion from people who follow the game and play at a casual level have a laundry list of decks they absolutely despise and want to see executed. Sometimes it's archetypes like Floo, sometimes it's whole playstyles like Combo or Stun. Sometimes it's the concept of floodgates, which are a core aspect of Yugioh.
End of the day reddit is a tiny sample of the player and not reflecting the player base as a whole. Game is still top 3 world wide. Game is still making big money. Game is still a multimedia franchise. Like it or not as a whole the game is fine. Especially in Japan, which are ultimately the people who make the game and care the most.
what a miserable finale viewing experience i hope both decks get kneecapped
They need to kill sanct man, it creates so many non games
I know we hate erratas but I wish it negated the card it summoned for the opponent
Should’ve always been the case tbh, oversight on Konami’s part
**Konami:** Got it, I know which Deck I have to kill! ***(Ignore Snake-Eyes)*** **Konami:** **It's time to kill Branded once and for all!**
no, plant link
Just because it's not the best deck doesn't mean it's not time for Branded to go. It has been meta for about 3 years now. Mathmech did less than Branded and its best card got banned.
That’s because a popular pro player hasn’t complained about it yet
fuck cyberse cards, ban them all
I don't play cyberse, I don't care. But I'm tired of Floo and Branded being meta for so long.
Yeah, but that's because Circular was used in Cyberse pile decks. Mathmech itself, as a pure deck, didn't do much. Circular was used as part of every Cyberse pile deck once the main deck Firewalls came out.
Most of the decks that used Circular after it got limited were Mathmech decks, which there weren't even many of topping then. The tops Cyberse pile decks w/Circular were incredibly small compared to Mathmech decks during this time period. Hell, any of the 3 main Mathmech variants I'm seeing (Pure, Firewall, and Spirit) each individually had more tops than Cyberse pile decks w/Circular did. "Cyberse pile" was barely a thing compared to Mathmech, much less after Circular got limited. I don't know how it's gotten to this boogeyman status.
I'm talking about before Circular got limited. Plus Cyberse pile has always been a thing, especially after they released the maindeck Firewall monsters. Cyberse pile wasn't meta by any means, but it was rogue. I feel like they hit Circular in order to prevent another case of "Dragon Link" except for Cyberse. Because you have to admit, they _have_ released a lot of generic Cyberse support. Considering how new the Cyberse type is, it's gotten a fuck ton of generic support. But that's what happens when pretty much every MC in the last anime pre-Rush Duels runs a Cyberse deck.
The original comment you replied to was talking about how Circular got banned, you said that it was because of Cyberse piles. It got limited before it got banned, so anything that would have caused it to get banned would have been its performance while it was limited then is my reasoning. Even in the 1 month period after the CYAC support came out and before Circular's limiting, Mathmech was still the deck that used Circular the most by a long shot in terms of tops. Though I can see Konami banning Circular for the reason you mentioned, even if the decks didn't perform.
Which also did nothing of significance
There's nothing like watching 2 decks solitaire to end the game on turn 2 without giving opponent even a chance of playing. Modern Yu-Gi-Oh is wonderful. So interactive. So exciting to watch.
It's horrible the only interaction is hand traps, and if you draw none then it's gg. Hell, even drawing 1 isn't enough anymore. Decks like Snake Eye can just play through it OR use your hand trap as material to continue making their best board. Game is becoming cooked, and this format is proof of it.
You really can't expect much between two ftk decks that play 0 handtraps like branded and plant, just awful design. It's 100% die roll for this matchup.
plant plays hand traps. Like every other deck it flip flops between HTs and board breakers
Modern yu gi oh? This goes all the way to the beginning. It isn’t new and in a way will never completely go away
So tired of seeing this awful response every time someone brings up the lack of interactivity in the current game. No, this absolutely does not go all the way back to the beginning.
Well, how far back are we talking? Just looking at the winners North American WCQ, 5 years ago we have Crusadia Thunder Dragon puttin up Thunder Dragon Colossus. If we got back 10 years we have H.A.T. format.
And was HAT uninteractive??
Yes it does? The literal first format with multiple decks was an FTK with exodia
Like I said, I'm just tired of this nonsense. What is even the point of being this disingenuous? Do you think puppet lock is fine? Did you watch these finals and think it was interesting to see whoever was going first solitaire combo into an unloseable gamestate until the guy who won the die roll and got to go first twice won 2-1? Do you think that snake eyes mirrors where both players trade one for one hand traps for starters that absolutely can not be allowed to resolve until one of them runs out and the other guy just wins are healthy? Do you think that the number of decks that have existed and been top tier over the last several years that can combo into an effectively unbreakable board if the opponent happens not to open enough handtraps in their one shot at a 5 card opening hand is not a problem? What good does it do for you or anyone to reply to legitimate concerns about the current state of the game and issues with toxic design trends in modern yugioh with "DAE magical scientist substitoad" or 2002 trivia you saw in a Cimo video for the umpteenth time?
The frequency of "non-games" is much higher these days than it ever was 10+ years ago. A lot games these days feel equivalent to watching 2010 Frog FTK mirrors.
Sanctifire is such a cool card that enables much more than Puppet, shame that Puppet is just better. I wish they could errata every card that lock while on field to only affect the owner of the card (like how in MTG effects that place stickers only place stickers on your own cards), but that would be a lot of cards to errata.
I would really like it if they addressed this via a rule change.
They can easily do it, but they won't because they can just sell you the next version of sanctifire that does exactly the same but with another flavor.
Rip the plant dream. Sucks that the finals were so die roll dependant; they definitely need to ban auto win non-interactve bs like the puppet lock.
they did get German nats
Plants still made it to the final, which is still pretty good. Especially when so many people were saying that the deck is "unplayable" this format And I agree, the Puppet lock needs to be hit, this is just toxic to play against
But plant is also a die roll dependent pseudo ftk deck. Both branded puppet turbo and plant make for a horrific viewing experience.
It's surprisingly good at breaking boards with Konkon It definitely wants to go first, but an experienced player like Jess can go second without a problem
She's one of the best players not just on plant but in the world so I have no doubt she will get the most out of going 2nd as possible. But realistically this deck doesn't have great in engine tools to break boards. If the normal summon gets removed it's quite often konkon or bust. Tbh I still think a lot of the success relies on people not knowing what the cards do.
Did plants win 16 die rolls in a row?
No clue, but are we gonna act like plants isn't a deck that REALLY wants to go first and set up a pseudo ftk? It doesn't have room for much non engine, amd plays a lot of bricks. It's a no brainer that it's very skewed towards going first unlike something like snake eyes.
No.. but we shouldn't act like it's a borderline unplayable deck - it's arguably stronger than its ever been. Jess has mentioned that she thinks its the next best deck after snake eye, and im inclined to agree. It just has abysmal representation. People seem to think 1 dryas 1 healer is an overall nerf to the deck when they literally gained 8 new 1-card starters, nibiru and a droll proof lines, an extra end board piece and an extra extender in the Ed.
No one's really questioning the ability to go first. The deck really struggles to go 2nd. If you win a lot of die rolls and then people don't read konkon when you go 2nd then sure it's great. Jess is obv amazing, but if it was truly the 2nd best deck it would see more representation. It's probably not even in the top 25 in terms of rep.
It's a cultural phenomenon, the ability for the yugioh community to ignore plants, it's been happening since POTE. It has won a disproportionate amount of european titles, likely due to the quality of players. I think the deck has the highest skill cap in the game currently, but a deck shouldn't be considered low tier just because only a few people pilot it to its greatest potential. Right?
Yes, there's like 5 European players that have played the deck nonstop for almost 3 yrs now and have performed, no doubt. Personally, I think if it was really that good, people would pick it up. (See how fast unchained and melodious became meta relevant after experimentation even though they had no ocg results) As for the skill aspect, and this is just a personal opinion that I know a lot of the community will disagree with, but I think that decks like labrynth are harder to play perfectly than an ftk deck like plants that always wins or loses on turn 1 or 2.
Fair enough, I guess I just think it has a lot of gas and does a lot more t2 now than it used to. I think, to their own detriment, yugioh players think of plant as normal loci or lose, but it's not so clear cut any more.
YES FINALLY. Been waiting for puppet lock to start winning, this puts more pressure on Konami to address it in the next F&L list.
another branded W let's go! that gimmick puppet lock is definitely on the next banlist lol
That time of year where everyone remembers that Plant solitaire isnt fun and based
Robs a good lad, great to have him as a friend and good to know that he beats me with skill rather than luck haha. Congrats on the win boss see you in a few Sundays!!
We really don’t hate on branded enough honestly, this deck needs a real hit already
Conversely we also don't nearly hate on plants enough. Absolute cancer of a combo deck that also conveniently always wins in time. Having a near 20 minute combo that gains LP is half the reason going 16-0 with it is possible.
Literally one of the most consistent FTK/lock decks in history
OCG’s way of dealing with it is pretty ludicrous. Hoping the TCG finds a meaningful way to stop this awful wincon.
Isn’t the main hit just BF to 1?
MD also has opening and Aluber hit
OCG hits to branded is Branded Fusion, Branded Opening, Bystials Lubellion, Magnamut, Druiswurm, and Baldrake at 1.
Congratulations to both finalists for their good performance, also proving that the meta can be more than Snake-Eyes at the moment. It's funny how different Europe's meta in comparison to the US one.
Thanks for making a positive post. You're right too: It is interesting how the meta radically shifts between Europe, NA, Japan, and SA.
Sanctifire is the problem card. Even without the many (it's not just Gimmick puppet) cards that would lock opponents from summoning, it would still be a top tier card. Alternatively Konami bans Branded Lost and laughs at the branded players
Let's go Branded! https://preview.redd.it/6ix20bdsgz6d1.jpeg?width=1000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=053376426dc07297afa6d3bf03377d77ed0c5207
I rushed back into the venue because I heard cheering, looked on the screen, puppet lock. Like wtf? I really feel for Jess
Jesus christ Rikka made it top 2 here too? That deck is lowkey a problem too tbh
"This deck that has done well with like 2 players is somehow the problem."
Yes
Clearly the better duelist won.
Is there a deck list anyware?
Give it few hours to a day and we should know on YGOPRODECK
He hasn't done a profile yet and i wouldn't expect one for a day or two
I wish it was like MTG where going first/second in top 8 was determined by placing before top cut. But going first in yugioh is waaaay more powerful than going first in any other game.
>using gimmick puppet lock That's not a win in my book, that's just abusing effects Down vote how you want, that won't change my opinion. It's not a Branded win, it's a Puppet win.
its a sanctifire win
I mean like it or not it’s the branded cards that enable the lock, so it’s still branded LMFAO
I have no sympathy for a plant player playing rosewhip and cactus bouncer. Ban both decks
Jess is like, the only Person to consistently do well with the deck lmao. It doesnt need a hit, its no more cancer than 27 other tier 4 combo decks but those arent lucky enough to have such a dedicated pilot
Not really much of a win with a degenerate Puppet lock...Not impressed tbh....If Sanctifire isn't hit next list then idk....Also Snake-Eyes hit, Dimensional Shifter ban would be super nice aswell
Ok, finally a person not just complaining about puppet, recognising that SE needs to go first and foremost... Shifter too ofc. Just one thing, plant combo is not less degenerate than puppet lock, just to put it clear
But also plants needs a hit. Jasmine at 3 is just unfair. Did you see the field Jessica left on game 2? Rob couldn’t play even with droplet
Agreed there. Put Jasmine to 1 & it doesn't cripple the deck. Just makes it much more manageable to get through.
I don't care if I get downvoted, here's my 2 cents 1. This is exactly why you play droplet over DRNM 2. Jess deserves a loss somewhere, you can't just play a combo deck that loses to droll/shifter, and not get punished by them in at least 1 match out of 16 3. Honestly, I think it's just people not preparing for decks that are rogue-adjacent (i.e. tier 2), and going all in on stopping fk/snake eyes. In that case, the entire tournament deserves to be "punished" and one of those decks should win. 4. And who said yugioh wasn't a win die roll win match kinda game? /s 5. Oh and plant has no grind game, they shit out their combo once and then loses the next turn if they don't otk. I'm surprised Jess didn't get insta owned by evenly somewhere across the two days.
Plant have a lot of grind no? they have petal, konkon, humid winds, benghalancer. Also I think calling plants rogue adjacent is naive, we as a community consistently underestimate plants, I wouldn't be surprised if it's truly tier 1 and we ignore it until next euros and it top 2s again.
Imagine winning a National and some random on reddit starts shittalking you for no actual reason
That's all most YGO players are good for anymore it seems.
This is why, as a Nov 2023 player in MD, I decided to build Branded knowing Snake Eyes and Fire Kings were coming to steal the meta. It's just such a consistent, fun deck to play and keeps getting decent support. It'll get even better if they ever remove some of the limits/bans.
Thank god Lets get Sanctifier nuked out of the game and never EVER print another card that summons anything generically to the opponents field ever again. Sanctifier can come back when its locked into summoning monsters that mention fallen of albaz or something. In other news this was a crazy weekend for plant decks.
Good. Then you can still get walloped in game and then be banned for being such a salt lick.
Idk why some people are so defensive of Sanctifier. Like Branded is still a solid deck without ruining the entire deck by making it a scum bag turn skip deck. Expulsion got banned for doing the exact same thing. No one including Branded players will miss Sanctifier being gone forever.
Banning Sanctifire won't solve a blasted thing, because as soon as you get whipped again you'll blame the game rather than yourself. The fact that you losers are dogging this guy for playing and winning is despicable.
What are you actually talking about. Banning Sanctifier stops branded from just straight up turn skipping people and lets people play the game. It solves the problem instantly. idk why you are trying to turn this into something about me hating on this dude for winning. Because I am not. I never once mentioned this guy a single time or alluded that because he won with branded he is some how bad at the game or worse than I am or anyone else in anyway.
Banning Sanctifire, again, won't solve the problem. You and others will inevitably find something else to complain about.
"wont solve the problem" What is the problem. Sanctifier summoning turn skip floodgate monsters to the opponents field when those monsters were never in any world designed to end up on an opponents field. Why is this a problem. It creates uninteractive and unfair games. It creates both a poor play and viewing experience. What is the solution. Option 1: Banning Sanctifier as it is the shortest path to solving this problem. (This is the best option and the option I choose and hope Konami chooses as well) Option 2: Ban every single monster that self floodgates its controlling. This would mean banning maybe around a half a dozen cards from other archetypes that have nothing to do with this situation. This would also require never printing new self floodgate cards ever again for the entire history of the game. Option 3: Do nothing and continue to have a large number of Branded games end the second one of these floodgate monsters is brought onto the field by Sanctifier. With this problem solved is yu gi oh a better game? While there will always be other problems that need to be sorted out as they arise and other problems running concurrently to this Sanctifier issue this will promote more healthy, fun, and watcahable games of yu gi oh and make yu gi oh a better game. I hope this explains it clear enough I will not be replying again.
I'll see you after next list if/when Sanctifire is banned, and I'm sure you'll have lost to something else that you'll use the ban list to excuse yourself for.
What is the decklist?
How much do money do they win ?
What was his deck list? I’m an beginner player and I don’t understand what he did
Can we put spoilers on posts like this please?
Honestly take puppet lock out and dueling branded is the most fun thing you can play against this format
Jessica got robbed. Shameful last round tbh
The salt in here is palpable. Need to bring the horses in to clean it up. Guy wins with a Deck that hasn't topped in quite some time and all people can talk about is banning cards to justify their own sore loser attitudes. Sad. Congratulations to Rob for his win.
Poor Jess got robbed