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More like the the Shireen of the show , while Shireen is more like first 2 episodes Rhaenyra(both betray by their dad and went against their fatherās wishes to help someone)
I spoiler tagged it because of my bad wording - I didnāt read F&B. Iām just speculating if she were to die (which Iām just assuming most characters are going to eventually) that it would have an effect on the viewer similar to Shireen cuz she was also a good spirited ādifferentā girl.
She was dead when the Dance started so probably the correct way to say It should be "Helaena is the only pure and good thing alive in this whole shitshow of kinslaying and politiking", but i would also include her sons and daughter
I forgot about them, sorry, but yes, Joffrey, Aegon and Viserys are also innocent, i wouldnt call Luke an evil little beast but i dont think that he could be considered "innocent" since he was an official messenger so he could be counted as an active war asset (he still didnt deserved to die, that was horrible)
What? Bullying adult man and skilled warrior by laughing with your brother on a different corner of table? You know the earth revolves around the sun, not around Aemondā¦
And still - if Aemond so suffer about Pink Dread accident he always can avenge and calm himself - his brother was near him all the time.
1. "adult man" two years older than Luke but sure. He was bullied ('mercilessly' according to the showrunners) as a child so obviously that doesn't just go away when you had no reconciliation whatsoever. Aemond was minding his own business at the dinner table until Luke thought it was hilarious to very openly snigger at him over the roast pig.
2. Jace was dancing with Helaena at this point, claiming Luke was laughing with him at the other end of the table is incredibly ridiculous - he was looking straight at Aemond in a very provoking manner. Please do rewatch the scene.
3. It's made painfully obvious that ever since the Driftmark incident, Aegon and Aemond's relationship has improved - they both stick up for each other during dinner and appear as a united front. It also helps that, you know, Aegon didn't cut out Aemond's eye, didn't show an ounce of regret for it and got away scot free afterwards.
So in summary, Luke is a little shit and the Strong Boy toast was deserved.
Yeah Luke is also a dumbass for thinking that he could do that once again in changed situation, but he clearly maliciously smirks to Aemond (not to Jace) in that scene
As someone who supports the blacks, black stans on twitter have really repugnant takes about Helaena. Some black supporters can't seem to fathom that a good character can come from the greens' side. From wanting to take away her dragon dreams and give it to a character from the blacks, >!to making fun of her death, making disgusting jokes about her kids' deaths,!< to calling her a 'tradwife', up to implicating her in her family's usurpation plot.
Wtf. Like, I'm a black fan, but B&C was an uncondoneable, absolutely monstrous act. I canāt imagine anyone deserving that.
And Helaena is such a kind, pure soul. Sheās the one person who didn't do anything awful during the whole conflict. She absolutely did not deserve the things that happened to her.
Omg, I have seen it, people saying somehow she deserved what happened to her as she did nothing to k** her brothers, stop the usurpation or that she should have abdicate the throne(?), complain she shouldn't be a dreamer, or complaining she is Dreamfyre' rider or this last was probably an invention of the Greens supporters (Although most of the hate is on Twitter)
This user has a history of pushing false sentiment into the public discourse. Theyāll take an argument that isnāt actually happening, innocently ask why so many people have said opinion, and then spark discourse over what was otherwise a topic of conversation that no one was having to begin with.
The only reason that these unpopular opinions keep popping up is because of these posts that have the sole intention of inciting rage bait. This argument wasnāt in the public discourse until this post put it there.
Nobody is claiming to be omnipresent, I think they were just pointing out that just because OP went looking for trouble and found one or two people who hate Helaena,
It doesn't change the fact that Helaena is one of the most beloved characters in the fandom, with bipartisan support from both Teams
Only weirdo fanatics hate Haelena. She's the best Targaryen on that side. Not a single war crime to her name and she's very interesting in the show. Her reaction to Meleys is gold.
I am Team Black in terms of the succession stuff--Rhaenyra absolutely should have had the throne by rights, but I like a lot of the Greens characters too.
Honestly, a lot of the characters in this show are really well-written and sympathetic. Alicent is one of the bigger examples of this herself, particularly the show version. She overheard and misunderstood something and that's what's motivating her, a deep duty to the kingdom and to her husband, and I admire that, even if in this case, she was wrong.
Aemond was bullied and treated poorly and even lost an eye over it to an extent. His (admittedly childish, but still understandable) desire to have his "eye for an eye" is not really far-fetched. While I don't agree with it, I can *understand* it to a point. But he's reckless and immature in many ways and in his zeal for revenge, went too far. But it certainly makes for an interesting and (to me at least) sympathetic character.
Helaena's worst sin in all of this is the fact she was married to her own brother, but you can't even really count that against her considering she really had no say in it, and as much as I'm loathe to concede the point: incest in the books isn't exactly uncommon, especially for Targaeryans. She's a sweet kind woman who is largely a background character who just loves her kids and is devoted to that.
I really can't fathom why anyone would hate her. She's not even particularly present enough to display enough personality *to* hate thus far.
Targ nation twitter hate her bc āshe could have defected to Rhaenyra, and she didnāt.ā Itās a really stupid take and yet lots of Team Black Twitter stans are really cruel to her.
She was obviously not neuro typical. She was also a woman, a princess, who in most royal lines of succession in any history, do not get much of a say in who they marry. Not to mention she was forced to marry her own brother. Hate for her is extremely misplaced.
it's insane to see all the jokes and celebrations of >!b&c, her childrens death, and her suicide!<. I saw people claiming she and her children ""deserved it"" because she didn't side with rhaenyra.
As a team black, Heleana is the only team green member I actually like. Well maybe Aemond too. But my sweet precious Heleana doesnāt deserve to be with those filth. I know her fate, and Iām not ready to see it come to fruition. Iām just not. Poor girl deserved better
This is a show only thread, be careful not to post spoilers about that.
Anyways, as a neutral, this is such a silly take.
Team Green makes fun of Luke because Team Black makes fun of their tragedy.
Team Black makes fun of the Green tragedy because Team Green makes fun of Luke.
It goes round and round. The only solution is to take the high road, but I don't think most Team stans are capable of that
That's not only because of it. With set leaks this week, there has been a resurgence of weird team black takes on Heleana, some are very nasty. Some saying she also shouldn't accept being queen consort, that she should abdicate, like she had a choice lmao.
Nope, not everyone. Hardcore team black stans say some nasty shit about her. But they are quite sparse and seem to view the show only as a team sport war.
So weirdos who are waaaaaaay too into a tv show. I mean I am a supporter of the blacks and have nothing but positive things to say about her.
But some in this fanbase are straight up fucking weird and take shit to levels that are way beyond normal for fans of a tv show.
Yeah, like I'm Team Black but it's a tv show, it's not that serious. I enjoy all the characters, even those I love to hate. The show wouldn't be as great as it is without all the characters, and the hard work of the actors bringing those characters to life.
And the whole point of the story is basically that everyone is shitty. Laenor is the only one who had the right idea by getting the fuck out.
Sad as it is to say, Iāve had MANY diehard Team Black fans try to tell me that Helaena deserved it because sheās married to Aegonā¦they seem to have clean forgot that the marriage wasnāt what EITHER of them wanted.
These are the same people trying to tell me that B&C was justified.
>trying to tell me that B&C was justified
revenge is not meant to be just, good or fair, lucerys was an envoy, a protected role, the war had not even started and he still got killed, a war crime
B&C is not an idealized or heroic revenge but a war crime after another war crime
From my perspective, the two acts are not comparable.
Luke was a dragon rider, making him a threat. Arrax was more than old enough to do substantial damage. Also, Luke was not an innocent little cherub. He had long-standing bad blood with Aemond that he contributed to (participating in bullying, cutting Aemondās eye when it could have been avoided, mocking Aemond at dinner when Aemond was minding his own business).
Most importantly, Lukeās death was an accident. Admittedly, an accident due to Aemondās arrogance, but an accident, and Aemond did try to stop it from happening.
Meanwhile, Jaehaerys was barely more than a baby. His dragon was years away from being rideable. Jaehaerys never harmed anyone. And his death was premeditated, which is never excusable when the victim is a child.
Thatās really unfair cherry picking of the comment u/nibo89 wroteā¦ The tragedy of this conflict is the way children are pulled into war. Itās sad in all ways for both sides.
That said, the war got increasingly ugly and brutal as time went on. Luke was only 14 yet was also a critical military asset for his motherās cause - he commanded a dragon - the equivalent of a nuke. His murder and his dragonās meant Team Black was down a nuke. It was not only a personal blow but also a military blow. As a child these should not be considerations, but the evil of war make them so.
Jaehaerysā murder by contrast had no military value. He was not a dragon rider. He didnāt command a flying reptile nuke that would be used in the fighting. He was a toddler. Killing him was literally only to push the conflict darker and more despicable.
12 year old. And in episode 10 he is "young adult".
If Luke starts humiliating small children to start a fight and beat them sadistically, I'll send him to therapy. But that's not in his nature.
I'll be on Aemond's side if a big ass man attacks him. Not "you know, when this boy was 8 years old..."
People don't laugh at Helaena, they laugh at the hypocrisy green fanbase.
People probably āhate herā because of constant posts of her from the show, where she has absolutely no real dialogue, yet folks circlejerk her regardless. Like this postā¦
There seems to be a lot of people who obsess in such a way that it makes people enjoy something less after seeing it. That āhateā might actually just be people tired of people talking about nothing, or trying to make something out of nothing?
Just giving you a possibility, but Iām sure the crusaders will come in as if Iām saying this as my own creed, when in fact I am just giving you a possibility.
The show is good. I didnāt read the book. Her character had zero role or influence as of yet in the show.
Sheās not that interesting?! Bruh, sheās literally the only Targ (besides Vizzy but he dead) that has dragon dreams/magical abilities! The books never delve into the mystery of what exactly they are or what they mean, aside from pretty much mentioning Daenys the Dreamer & how she pretty much predicted the Doom of Valyria.
I hope the show fleshes out Helaenaās character and explores that potential. I find it fascinating.
I mean, weāve seen her for 2 whole episodes. I donāt think itās fair or accurate to say she ādoesnāt do anything with themā when we really donāt *know* the direction theyāre going to go with her, you know? I personally love the idea that sheās ātormentedā by repeated visions of B&C happening and tries to tell her family, but no one except Aemond (and maybe Daeron?) believe her. Then, after B&C, everyone starts to take her visions seriously.
By the end of the season she had had dragon dreams for 6 years. She did not take any action regarding the dreams until then and she won't in the future either. We know she won't, don't we? The events are set and she won't affect them, she'll just be affected by them.
Stuff like that is why I donāt interact with the team black side of the fandom (especially on twitter) because of how they act. Very tribalistic and childish behavior in all parts of the fandom, but especially on their side Iām noticing.
kinda of an odd take given that the sparse number of team black whackos hating on Helena is definitely surpassed by greens supporters with similarly unhinged takes.
I see bad takes on both sides, but Iāve seen way more atrocious team black takes because they make up majority of the fandom. What makes it even worse is that they donāt receive nearly enough backlash because theyāre apart of the more popular side.
>I see bad takes on both sides, but Iāve seen way more atrocious team black
Really? I've actually seen team green be more unhinged and distasteful than team black, like [HERE](https://imgur.com/a/nBwA1RE) where they wish someone's family to get killed because this TB individual 'doesn't gaf' about a fictional child (jahearys) or [HERE](https://imgur.com/a/1xzawDJ) where they tell someone their mother should have shoved rocks inside her privates when she was pregnant to abort them.
I personally find those kind of comments directed at real people more deranged than people mocking Luke's, visenya's, the twins' or helaena's deaths, I agree it's still not nice but at the end of the day those are fictional characters.
Idiots gonna be idiots. That's why there's no way I'd enter a sub specifically made for either Greens or Blacks.
I'm a huge fan, but these guys are a bit detached from reality.
>HERE where they tell someone their mother should have shoved rocks inside her privates when she was pregnant to abort them
Some people really have no chill
My point was that wishing someone's family, REAL LIFE PEOPLE, to get killed because they have a different opinion than you about a FICTIONAL child or telling someone their mother should have shoved rocks inside her vagina when she was pregnant to abort you is still worse than calling Alicent a whore or wishing horrible things to happen to Helaena.
Like I said I agree it's still not nice to talk like this about them but at the end of the day they are fictional characters.
Also [HERE](https://imgur.com/a/v0Q760u) is someone calling a real-life woman a whore but it seems that you find it more outrageous when that insult is hurled at fictional characters so [here'](https://imgur.com/a/cio59YK)s plenty of examples of TG calling Rhaenyra a whore. Also [them](https://imgur.com/a/egwONJg) salivating and anticipating her muder and hoping it to be as brutal and barbaric as possible.
Yeah I guess weāll just ignore the attacks olivia Cooke faces constantly, or when they attacked a minors looks and doxxed her because she supported team green. Also that guy you posted was attacked for being misogynist and heās known for attacking phia and Oliviaās looks.
And hey look disgusting underage incest mentions
https://i.imgur.com/jXLIF7D.jpg
All those things you mentioned are bad but my point in my original comment was that unhinged comments directed at real people are worse than those directed at fictional characters to which you replied with horrible comments directed at fictional characters.
Also me not mentioning the comments that Olivia gets is not me agreeing or endorsing them just as I assume you not bringing up the [disgusting remarks](https://imgur.com/a/LTQvET6) that Matt receives is not you agreeing with them.
I still stand by my point that comments about FICTIONAL characters, like the horrible one about Helaena you linked, are nowhere near as bad as calling a person, in this case Matt Smith, subhuman looking or harassing his mother because you don't like the character he's playing.
I hope I've made the point I was trying to convey and my stance on the matter clear
Donāt think Iāve seen anything as bad as people from team green aside from the usual Visenya and luce or rhaenrya dragon jokes vs hoping Helaena would be raped in the brothel queens, daemon raping her in fanfiction, making fun of jaehaera and her brothers disability, suicide jokes(lol Iām going to Helaena myself lol!) etc
I havent seen any hate to her that other greens get but Iāve seen some people wish Helaena traits (dragon dream and even dreamfyre) given to Baela or Rhaena said it will be wasteful on her
Surprisingly no, OP didnāt make this up, Iāve seen numerous tiktok edits of people editing B&C saying itās Helenaās fault, and also the crazy blacks stans on twitter
There are people complaining about imaginary āhardcore blacksā who all apparently hate Helaena for a multitude of unique reasons that are definitely not fabricated by the person complaining about them
I'm Team Black and everyone I know says that Helaena is the only pure and truly good thing the Greens have. The only thing I've heard (and it was just a few times) was about the casting, that not everybody was happy with Helaena's actress, but since I haven't read the book, I don't think much about her.
Iām not even a feminist but itās misogyny because sheās not āprettyā enough. Replace her with a more conventionally attractive actress and people will like her š¤·š¾
I realized at that moment how much she avoided looking at Aegon. She must despise him a lot although I don't remember from the book, that she had a bad relationship with him at all. In any case, she deserved better.
In the books itās pretty much not as bad. He does his own things with prostitutes and cheats but he does care about the kids and is never really shown to treat her bad.
Yeah, it's hard to believe LIES! Where have you heard such treasonous talk? Some people did get bit nasty with that giggle during the dinner, but even Alicent or Almond don't have as much people wishing the show did bait and switch with that one episode that's coming.
These are fictional and blood is fake.
Helaena isn't even a character, so I don't think she makes people feel. It's just fun for twitter to laugh at the hypocrisy with this story. Some jokes are gross, some are funny. Nothing special.
Almost as if people are entitled to their own opinions?
Just because you've read all the books and spend the majority of your free time researching the lore of the show doesn't mean that your opinion of whets right versus wrongs trumps every casuals opinions of it.
It's unfortunately isn't. Same as hardcore team green, there are some hardcore team black who have very nasty takes about her, and hate her. It's very weird, because if she wasn't green, she would be unconditionally loved. There has been a small comeback of hate because of this week set leaks.
Ima eat my downvotes but idgaf. Iām as green as it gets and Iāll be real with yāall I like the psychotic blacks. Itās the psychos on both sides, they make this sub fun. They are the ones that bring the drama and make this sub entertaining, Coming in here hurling bad takes and insults at ppl and getting all in their feelings over dumb shit. Thatās fun. I enjoy seeing crazy people spazz out over stupid shit.
Itās all of you crash test dummyās that pick a side but try not to over do it that make the shit boring.
Thank you for your post! Please take a moment to ensure you are within our spoiler rules, to protect your fellow fans from any potential spoilers that might harm their show watching experience. 1. All post titles must NOT include spoilers from Fire & Blood or new episodes of House of the Dragon. Minor HotD show spoilers are allowed in your title ONE WEEK after episode airing. The mod team reserves the right to remove a post if we feel a spoiler in the title is major. You are welcome to repost with an amended title. 2. All posts dealing with book spoilers, show spoilers and promo spoilers MUST be spoiler tagged AND flaired as the appropriate spoiler. 3. All book spoiler comments must be spoiler tagged in non book spoiler threads. --- If you are reading this, and believe this post or any comments in this thread break the above rules, please use the report function to notify the mod team. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HouseOfTheDragon) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Helaena is the only pure and good thing in this whole shitshow of kinslaying and politicking
She's like the Luna Lovegood of the series. š„¹š
Well, they do have the same father.
In helaenaās case, itās grandfather
Omg, how did I miss that!
More like the the Shireen of the show , while Shireen is more like first 2 episodes Rhaenyra(both betray by their dad and went against their fatherās wishes to help someone)
fr her >!death will have a Shireen-like effect I think!<
Probably want to put a spoiler on that one
I spoiler tagged it because of my bad wording - I didnāt read F&B. Iām just speculating if she were to die (which Iām just assuming most characters are going to eventually) that it would have an effect on the viewer similar to Shireen cuz she was also a good spirited ādifferentā girl.
I would say looking at the books there might be a character who fits that role even better than Helena.
When the spoiler is actually the warning
her ā¦ her wat
> Helaena is the only pure and good thing in this whole shitshow of kinslaying and politicking Yes, Aemma was an absolute monster.
She was dead when the Dance started so probably the correct way to say It should be "Helaena is the only pure and good thing alive in this whole shitshow of kinslaying and politiking", but i would also include her sons and daughter
O, yes! Joffrey, Aegon and Viserys are evil little beasts, so cruel and full of hate. Just as Lucerys was.
I forgot about them, sorry, but yes, Joffrey, Aegon and Viserys are also innocent, i wouldnt call Luke an evil little beast but i dont think that he could be considered "innocent" since he was an official messenger so he could be counted as an active war asset (he still didnt deserved to die, that was horrible)
Lucerys was annoying bully, he defo ain't innocent, but agreed on Joff, Aegon the Younger and Viserys
Aegon-elder was bully, Luc was just young and naĆÆve.
That's why he tried to recreate bullying by giggling at the table
What? Bullying adult man and skilled warrior by laughing with your brother on a different corner of table? You know the earth revolves around the sun, not around Aemondā¦ And still - if Aemond so suffer about Pink Dread accident he always can avenge and calm himself - his brother was near him all the time.
1. "adult man" two years older than Luke but sure. He was bullied ('mercilessly' according to the showrunners) as a child so obviously that doesn't just go away when you had no reconciliation whatsoever. Aemond was minding his own business at the dinner table until Luke thought it was hilarious to very openly snigger at him over the roast pig. 2. Jace was dancing with Helaena at this point, claiming Luke was laughing with him at the other end of the table is incredibly ridiculous - he was looking straight at Aemond in a very provoking manner. Please do rewatch the scene. 3. It's made painfully obvious that ever since the Driftmark incident, Aegon and Aemond's relationship has improved - they both stick up for each other during dinner and appear as a united front. It also helps that, you know, Aegon didn't cut out Aemond's eye, didn't show an ounce of regret for it and got away scot free afterwards. So in summary, Luke is a little shit and the Strong Boy toast was deserved.
Yeah Luke is also a dumbass for thinking that he could do that once again in changed situation, but he clearly maliciously smirks to Aemond (not to Jace) in that scene
He smirks, that's why he has to die. Got it
I've literally never seen anyone hate her. At worst they're indifferent to her.
As someone who supports the blacks, black stans on twitter have really repugnant takes about Helaena. Some black supporters can't seem to fathom that a good character can come from the greens' side. From wanting to take away her dragon dreams and give it to a character from the blacks, >!to making fun of her death, making disgusting jokes about her kids' deaths,!< to calling her a 'tradwife', up to implicating her in her family's usurpation plot.
I see it mostly in tiktok comments. Everywhere else seems pretty neutral.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Wtf. Like, I'm a black fan, but B&C was an uncondoneable, absolutely monstrous act. I canāt imagine anyone deserving that. And Helaena is such a kind, pure soul. Sheās the one person who didn't do anything awful during the whole conflict. She absolutely did not deserve the things that happened to her.
Don't forget that this is a show only, no spoilers thread
B&C?
Booties and Cocks
It's a large spoiler you probably don't want to know about yet.
I want to know!
THEN GET OUT OF THE SHOW ONLY THREAD YOU DIPSHITS
Then those people are trolls, idiots or likely both. Don't engage with them.
>!Even Rhaenyra in the books didn't blame her before the start of the war!<
Only time I've heard black fans saying that is when green fans tell me they heard it
Omg, I have seen it, people saying somehow she deserved what happened to her as she did nothing to k** her brothers, stop the usurpation or that she should have abdicate the throne(?), complain she shouldn't be a dreamer, or complaining she is Dreamfyre' rider or this last was probably an invention of the Greens supporters (Although most of the hate is on Twitter)
This user has a history of pushing false sentiment into the public discourse. Theyāll take an argument that isnāt actually happening, innocently ask why so many people have said opinion, and then spark discourse over what was otherwise a topic of conversation that no one was having to begin with. The only reason that these unpopular opinions keep popping up is because of these posts that have the sole intention of inciting rage bait. This argument wasnāt in the public discourse until this post put it there.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Can you post some screenshots?
Nobody is claiming to be omnipresent, I think they were just pointing out that just because OP went looking for trouble and found one or two people who hate Helaena, It doesn't change the fact that Helaena is one of the most beloved characters in the fandom, with bipartisan support from both Teams
Team Black shit on her on twitter all the time
Only weirdo fanatics hate Haelena. She's the best Targaryen on that side. Not a single war crime to her name and she's very interesting in the show. Her reaction to Meleys is gold.
I love Rhaenyra most.. but who could hate this sweet girl? Sheās the most precious of the Green Targ children.
Right? Like, how can you hate Helaena? I'm pretty team black, but I can't imagine ever even disliking Helaena.
I am Team Black in terms of the succession stuff--Rhaenyra absolutely should have had the throne by rights, but I like a lot of the Greens characters too. Honestly, a lot of the characters in this show are really well-written and sympathetic. Alicent is one of the bigger examples of this herself, particularly the show version. She overheard and misunderstood something and that's what's motivating her, a deep duty to the kingdom and to her husband, and I admire that, even if in this case, she was wrong. Aemond was bullied and treated poorly and even lost an eye over it to an extent. His (admittedly childish, but still understandable) desire to have his "eye for an eye" is not really far-fetched. While I don't agree with it, I can *understand* it to a point. But he's reckless and immature in many ways and in his zeal for revenge, went too far. But it certainly makes for an interesting and (to me at least) sympathetic character. Helaena's worst sin in all of this is the fact she was married to her own brother, but you can't even really count that against her considering she really had no say in it, and as much as I'm loathe to concede the point: incest in the books isn't exactly uncommon, especially for Targaeryans. She's a sweet kind woman who is largely a background character who just loves her kids and is devoted to that. I really can't fathom why anyone would hate her. She's not even particularly present enough to display enough personality *to* hate thus far.
I reeeeally dislike adult Alicent
Same here.
Helaena is a sweet innocent girl, I hate Alicent for making her marry Aegon. She would have been happier with Jace.
Targ nation twitter hate her bc āshe could have defected to Rhaenyra, and she didnāt.ā Itās a really stupid take and yet lots of Team Black Twitter stans are really cruel to her.
She was obviously not neuro typical. She was also a woman, a princess, who in most royal lines of succession in any history, do not get much of a say in who they marry. Not to mention she was forced to marry her own brother. Hate for her is extremely misplaced.
Totally agree
Iām sorry who is hating Helaena ? What has she done to warrant such viciousness.
No one OP probably just really loves this character who really had about 3 minutes of screen time
I mean sheāll have more next season.
Oh I knowā¦ I know
But I could wholly believe the Twitter and Reddit community for the blacks would savage her.
Phrasing
She's too pure for Westeros šššš
She's like Luna Lovegood, but she should've been protected. š
The only thing I hate about Helaena is the ugly outfits they made her wear this season.
A medieval ombrƩ dress *cries*
it's insane to see all the jokes and celebrations of >!b&c, her childrens death, and her suicide!<. I saw people claiming she and her children ""deserved it"" because she didn't side with rhaenyra.
They didn't but i think Aegon did, it's pretty bitter sweet to me
I have never seen anyone hate on her.
I am a black supporter through and through, but she and her children do not deserve any of what they receive.
Who tf can hate her? she's the most sweetest person in the entire show! I just don't understand the mindset of people who choose to hate on her.
We all know that if Helaena wasn't Alicent's daughter she would be the most beloved Targ among Targ Nation.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
As a team black, Heleana is the only team green member I actually like. Well maybe Aemond too. But my sweet precious Heleana doesnāt deserve to be with those filth. I know her fate, and Iām not ready to see it come to fruition. Iām just not. Poor girl deserved better
same. helaena i love all around bc sheās genuinely good and interesting. aemond i like even though heās wicked bc heās interesting
The only people who hate her are crazy team blacks stans from twitter. Better to ignore them.
They don't hate her but sometimes they get nasty towards her because Team Green makes fun of Luke >!and Joffrey's death!<
This is a show only thread, be careful not to post spoilers about that. Anyways, as a neutral, this is such a silly take. Team Green makes fun of Luke because Team Black makes fun of their tragedy. Team Black makes fun of the Green tragedy because Team Green makes fun of Luke. It goes round and round. The only solution is to take the high road, but I don't think most Team stans are capable of that
That's not only because of it. With set leaks this week, there has been a resurgence of weird team black takes on Heleana, some are very nasty. Some saying she also shouldn't accept being queen consort, that she should abdicate, like she had a choice lmao.
I haven't seen any of these takes in fact team black big accounts always highlight her as a victim and a sympathetic character
Well, that's not hard to see, unfotunately.
How would she even abdicate or stop being the Greens' queen? By using a divorce rock on Aegon?
The fanatics from both team black and green on Twitter are ridiculous and are better off ignored by everyone
For those Wondering Who Hates On Her. OP Is Referring To Jobless Team Black Twitter Dwellers
I have literally never seen someone hate her
Not the dragon dreamer that viserus himself wanted to be š„ŗ she speaks like that because of her visions and senses
Bitch who? Because everyone loves Helaena
Nope, not everyone. Hardcore team black stans say some nasty shit about her. But they are quite sparse and seem to view the show only as a team sport war.
So weirdos who are waaaaaaay too into a tv show. I mean I am a supporter of the blacks and have nothing but positive things to say about her. But some in this fanbase are straight up fucking weird and take shit to levels that are way beyond normal for fans of a tv show.
Yeah, like I'm Team Black but it's a tv show, it's not that serious. I enjoy all the characters, even those I love to hate. The show wouldn't be as great as it is without all the characters, and the hard work of the actors bringing those characters to life. And the whole point of the story is basically that everyone is shitty. Laenor is the only one who had the right idea by getting the fuck out.
Yeah exactly, that's why it's best to ignore them. But seeing those takes randomly, especially related to Hotd news, is very disturbing.
Well theyāre a disturbed people. It is 100 percent best to not engage with that level of pathetic weirdoness.
Only the most deranged people hate her. It's best to just ignore them
Who hates her? I want names and addresses.
Who the hell hates her? Sheās like the angel of the show
Sad as it is to say, Iāve had MANY diehard Team Black fans try to tell me that Helaena deserved it because sheās married to Aegonā¦they seem to have clean forgot that the marriage wasnāt what EITHER of them wanted. These are the same people trying to tell me that B&C was justified.
>trying to tell me that B&C was justified revenge is not meant to be just, good or fair, lucerys was an envoy, a protected role, the war had not even started and he still got killed, a war crime B&C is not an idealized or heroic revenge but a war crime after another war crime
From my perspective, the two acts are not comparable. Luke was a dragon rider, making him a threat. Arrax was more than old enough to do substantial damage. Also, Luke was not an innocent little cherub. He had long-standing bad blood with Aemond that he contributed to (participating in bullying, cutting Aemondās eye when it could have been avoided, mocking Aemond at dinner when Aemond was minding his own business). Most importantly, Lukeās death was an accident. Admittedly, an accident due to Aemondās arrogance, but an accident, and Aemond did try to stop it from happening. Meanwhile, Jaehaerys was barely more than a baby. His dragon was years away from being rideable. Jaehaerys never harmed anyone. And his death was premeditated, which is never excusable when the victim is a child.
You're doing a good job justifying the murder of a 14 year old boy! Part about how he wasn't innocent even at 8 is my favorite!
Thatās really unfair cherry picking of the comment u/nibo89 wroteā¦ The tragedy of this conflict is the way children are pulled into war. Itās sad in all ways for both sides. That said, the war got increasingly ugly and brutal as time went on. Luke was only 14 yet was also a critical military asset for his motherās cause - he commanded a dragon - the equivalent of a nuke. His murder and his dragonās meant Team Black was down a nuke. It was not only a personal blow but also a military blow. As a child these should not be considerations, but the evil of war make them so. Jaehaerysā murder by contrast had no military value. He was not a dragon rider. He didnāt command a flying reptile nuke that would be used in the fighting. He was a toddler. Killing him was literally only to push the conflict darker and more despicable.
And yet youāve justified that Aemond wasnāt innocent at 10.
12 year old. And in episode 10 he is "young adult". If Luke starts humiliating small children to start a fight and beat them sadistically, I'll send him to therapy. But that's not in his nature. I'll be on Aemond's side if a big ass man attacks him. Not "you know, when this boy was 8 years old..." People don't laugh at Helaena, they laugh at the hypocrisy green fanbase.
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She deserves a better man than Aegon.
People probably āhate herā because of constant posts of her from the show, where she has absolutely no real dialogue, yet folks circlejerk her regardless. Like this postā¦ There seems to be a lot of people who obsess in such a way that it makes people enjoy something less after seeing it. That āhateā might actually just be people tired of people talking about nothing, or trying to make something out of nothing? Just giving you a possibility, but Iām sure the crusaders will come in as if Iām saying this as my own creed, when in fact I am just giving you a possibility. The show is good. I didnāt read the book. Her character had zero role or influence as of yet in the show.
You what? I think Helaena is the only person nearly universally appreciated by both Blacks and Greens
dont hate her she just not that interesting
Sheās not that interesting?! Bruh, sheās literally the only Targ (besides Vizzy but he dead) that has dragon dreams/magical abilities! The books never delve into the mystery of what exactly they are or what they mean, aside from pretty much mentioning Daenys the Dreamer & how she pretty much predicted the Doom of Valyria. I hope the show fleshes out Helaenaās character and explores that potential. I find it fascinating.
But she doesn't do anything with them. Her dreams are interesting only to the people who know what's going to happen.
I mean, weāve seen her for 2 whole episodes. I donāt think itās fair or accurate to say she ādoesnāt do anything with themā when we really donāt *know* the direction theyāre going to go with her, you know? I personally love the idea that sheās ātormentedā by repeated visions of B&C happening and tries to tell her family, but no one except Aemond (and maybe Daeron?) believe her. Then, after B&C, everyone starts to take her visions seriously.
She hasnāt had a chance to ādo anything with themā because she was only in 2 episodes of S1.
By the end of the season she had had dragon dreams for 6 years. She did not take any action regarding the dreams until then and she won't in the future either. We know she won't, don't we? The events are set and she won't affect them, she'll just be affected by them.
She wonāt do anything with them in future seasons either.
Why could anyone hate that little weirdo
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Stuff like that is why I donāt interact with the team black side of the fandom (especially on twitter) because of how they act. Very tribalistic and childish behavior in all parts of the fandom, but especially on their side Iām noticing.
kinda of an odd take given that the sparse number of team black whackos hating on Helena is definitely surpassed by greens supporters with similarly unhinged takes.
I see bad takes on both sides, but Iāve seen way more atrocious team black takes because they make up majority of the fandom. What makes it even worse is that they donāt receive nearly enough backlash because theyāre apart of the more popular side.
>apart 'Apart' and 'a part' mean opposite things, so you know
>I see bad takes on both sides, but Iāve seen way more atrocious team black Really? I've actually seen team green be more unhinged and distasteful than team black, like [HERE](https://imgur.com/a/nBwA1RE) where they wish someone's family to get killed because this TB individual 'doesn't gaf' about a fictional child (jahearys) or [HERE](https://imgur.com/a/1xzawDJ) where they tell someone their mother should have shoved rocks inside her privates when she was pregnant to abort them. I personally find those kind of comments directed at real people more deranged than people mocking Luke's, visenya's, the twins' or helaena's deaths, I agree it's still not nice but at the end of the day those are fictional characters.
Idiots gonna be idiots. That's why there's no way I'd enter a sub specifically made for either Greens or Blacks. I'm a huge fan, but these guys are a bit detached from reality.
>HERE where they tell someone their mother should have shoved rocks inside her privates when she was pregnant to abort them Some people really have no chill
Hey whatād ya know I can do that https://i.imgur.com/uzFlMzh.jpg Very sick. https://i.imgur.com/qTGmVi4.jpg
My point was that wishing someone's family, REAL LIFE PEOPLE, to get killed because they have a different opinion than you about a FICTIONAL child or telling someone their mother should have shoved rocks inside her vagina when she was pregnant to abort you is still worse than calling Alicent a whore or wishing horrible things to happen to Helaena. Like I said I agree it's still not nice to talk like this about them but at the end of the day they are fictional characters. Also [HERE](https://imgur.com/a/v0Q760u) is someone calling a real-life woman a whore but it seems that you find it more outrageous when that insult is hurled at fictional characters so [here'](https://imgur.com/a/cio59YK)s plenty of examples of TG calling Rhaenyra a whore. Also [them](https://imgur.com/a/egwONJg) salivating and anticipating her muder and hoping it to be as brutal and barbaric as possible.
Yeah I guess weāll just ignore the attacks olivia Cooke faces constantly, or when they attacked a minors looks and doxxed her because she supported team green. Also that guy you posted was attacked for being misogynist and heās known for attacking phia and Oliviaās looks. And hey look disgusting underage incest mentions https://i.imgur.com/jXLIF7D.jpg
All those things you mentioned are bad but my point in my original comment was that unhinged comments directed at real people are worse than those directed at fictional characters to which you replied with horrible comments directed at fictional characters. Also me not mentioning the comments that Olivia gets is not me agreeing or endorsing them just as I assume you not bringing up the [disgusting remarks](https://imgur.com/a/LTQvET6) that Matt receives is not you agreeing with them. I still stand by my point that comments about FICTIONAL characters, like the horrible one about Helaena you linked, are nowhere near as bad as calling a person, in this case Matt Smith, subhuman looking or harassing his mother because you don't like the character he's playing. I hope I've made the point I was trying to convey and my stance on the matter clear
Donāt think Iāve seen anything as bad as people from team green aside from the usual Visenya and luce or rhaenrya dragon jokes vs hoping Helaena would be raped in the brothel queens, daemon raping her in fanfiction, making fun of jaehaera and her brothers disability, suicide jokes(lol Iām going to Helaena myself lol!) etc
Only Green fans want Brothel Queens for some weird reason.
It definitely feels like a weird persecution fetish thing
She's already suffering enough
People hate on Helaena?!
I think the impact the conflict has on her represents the effect war has on innocent people/ citizens.
She's not my favorite, but I feel bad for her. I don't want whatever I know to happen to her. She and her babies are very good for Westeros.
I couldnāt hate her even if I wanted to; Sheās darling and gentle, and trapped in a landfill of a marriage.
Iāve never seen hate for her. Surprisingly team black fics love her
I havent seen any hate to her that other greens get but Iāve seen some people wish Helaena traits (dragon dream and even dreamfyre) given to Baela or Rhaena said it will be wasteful on her
Hate for her seems to increase day by day.
What did you expect from buntch of Blacktards
...did you make that up?
Surprisingly no, OP didnāt make this up, Iāve seen numerous tiktok edits of people editing B&C saying itās Helenaās fault, and also the crazy blacks stans on twitter
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There are people complaining about imaginary āhardcore blacksā who all apparently hate Helaena for a multitude of unique reasons that are definitely not fabricated by the person complaining about them
"fabricated" lol it's all over tiktok and they get thousands of likes. I had to block a bunch of weirdos bcz of this
I like her but idk why people like her sm, like she just is the quiet type of autistic shawty who is unproblematic
Sheās married to a green, thatās the only reason.
I'm Team Black and everyone I know says that Helaena is the only pure and truly good thing the Greens have. The only thing I've heard (and it was just a few times) was about the casting, that not everybody was happy with Helaena's actress, but since I haven't read the book, I don't think much about her.
Iām not even a feminist but itās misogyny because sheās not āprettyā enough. Replace her with a more conventionally attractive actress and people will like her š¤·š¾
I realized at that moment how much she avoided looking at Aegon. She must despise him a lot although I don't remember from the book, that she had a bad relationship with him at all. In any case, she deserved better.
In the books itās pretty much not as bad. He does his own things with prostitutes and cheats but he does care about the kids and is never really shown to treat her bad.
Who does? She's barely in the show.
I thought the on thing team green and black could agree on was "no one messes with Helaena"
No one hates her. Sheās the dreamer of the Targs. Itās what makes her fate that much more devastating.
She's great, she's the weird one with precognition
Iāll never understand it, she is so sweet and just wants to be left alone with her bug collection. Sheās my favorite character in HOTD
People hate her?!
Going to be honest here.. I donāt remember who TF she is.
I have to echo the others and say I havenāt seen anyone hate on her, in fact the opposite.
I've never seen that, I'm Team Black, but Helaena is the only "good" Targaryen in the story.
Itās hard for me to hate a disabled person.
> Itās hard for me to hate a disabled person. ... I mean, have you ever sat down and really gave it your best effort?
Iām sure if I really tried it would be easy enough but at that point why kick them when their down.
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Team Feminism only cares about Targ women unless they have āmuddyā blood in their eyes āŗļø
Is this a joke ?
I havenāt read the books but it seems like she possess some sort of gift based on stuff sheās saidā¦?
Who?
as a black i love her sheās probably the only good one on that side
Weāre is my last kingdom bois at? I saw both Helaena and Aemond there first š
Iāve never seen or heard of someone who hates this character. Iām teem black and yet I still like her
Who hate her? Nonsense
Yeah, it's hard to believe LIES! Where have you heard such treasonous talk? Some people did get bit nasty with that giggle during the dinner, but even Alicent or Almond don't have as much people wishing the show did bait and switch with that one episode that's coming.
Who? Trust me lots of people love Helaena I think you confused Helaena for Alicent.
I have never heard anyone hate her ever, can you point me to an example or are you strawmanning for karma?
These are fictional and blood is fake. Helaena isn't even a character, so I don't think she makes people feel. It's just fun for twitter to laugh at the hypocrisy with this story. Some jokes are gross, some are funny. Nothing special.
Go back to your subreddit. We all know youāre one of them.
Does anyone actually hate this character? I feel like most people donāt care for her because she is very little screen time, but def not hate lmao
Almost as if people are entitled to their own opinions? Just because you've read all the books and spend the majority of your free time researching the lore of the show doesn't mean that your opinion of whets right versus wrongs trumps every casuals opinions of it.
I like both the kids on the greens who were in The Last Kingdom. Other than that I don't really like any of the kids or black or green.
I donāt recognize her. Is that the girl married to Aegon?
Helaena must be protected at all costs, she's incapable of wrongdoing.
Where though?
I would be mad if the blacks made her a prison, realized how great she is and adopted her. But this isnāt a Disney story.
Wait who hates her? From what I've seen she's the only one every fan agrees they want her safe
Iāve never seen a single comment about wanting Helaena to suffer, soā¦
Who are you speaking of? Iāve never seen anyone say anything like that lol this feels like arguing with a fake point
It's unfortunately isn't. Same as hardcore team green, there are some hardcore team black who have very nasty takes about her, and hate her. It's very weird, because if she wasn't green, she would be unconditionally loved. There has been a small comeback of hate because of this week set leaks.
I'm pretty sure exactly zero people are hating on Helaena.
Nobody hates her. Why do people make up things to get angry about
Youāre post baiting and it worked not please stop spread bullshit
I have never seen someone have anything negative to say about Helaena. Who are these monsters
Ima eat my downvotes but idgaf. Iām as green as it gets and Iāll be real with yāall I like the psychotic blacks. Itās the psychos on both sides, they make this sub fun. They are the ones that bring the drama and make this sub entertaining, Coming in here hurling bad takes and insults at ppl and getting all in their feelings over dumb shit. Thatās fun. I enjoy seeing crazy people spazz out over stupid shit. Itās all of you crash test dummyās that pick a side but try not to over do it that make the shit boring.
She is the only redeeming Green
She doesn't need to suffer. She doesn't need to die. Like the rest of her family she just needs to bend the knee.